Karaoke Forums

I believe there was a thread about this but I am unable to find it.

Does anyone here perform with CD instead of with a band? If so what are the plus and minus sides? Does your audience feel cheated by not having a full band? How much do you charge per gig?

Yes I have done it.
On how much to charge - I think it mainly has to do with the area
you live in and the job. Although I've only done it a few times, here (in the Chicago suburbs) I've charged $75 an hour the 1st 3 hours, $50 an hour after.
I wouldn't worry that you don't have a band. If they wanted a band they would have hired one. Most places that like this are your smaller establishments that want softer music. Bands have a tendency to get way to loud.

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I use CDs and to date I've haven't had any problems.  On the Island there are several very popular singers that also use CDs.

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Singing just for you

Thank you Babs.

Years ago I performed either solo (basic thythm guitar) or with back up people that were chosen on spur of the moment. It was pointless trying to get a band together because it was Miami, Florida and it is very transient there. Also, when you count on other people, they often times let you down by not showing or getting drunk and looking pretty silly as well as unprofessional.

Now people are pressuring me to start performing again but I didn't want the hassle of dealing with trying to get a band together and then keeping it together. My friends got into a discussion and decided that the best thing for me to do would be to go out and use CDs to back me; I was afraid this would be frowned upon. My firends keep insisting it is about the singing and stage presence and not who is or isn't backing the singer. I am trying to figure out if it is possible to put on a good show with CD backing and if it is worth it and if the audience enjoys it any less than having an actual band backing the vocalist?

I'm in a group that uses CDs almost exclusively. (I say almost because I'm a saxophonist and put a sax set in).

Upsides - Less equipment and no instrumental mistakes, good for smaller venues, not limited by musicians ability/knowledge

Downsides -  Duff CD's (always have spares)!, can't do that last verse 'one more time', not the live sound of a band.

I agree with Countrybumkin that if a venue want's a band they will book a band. If you advertise yourself as a soloist no one should expect you to play guitar, bass, drums, the tambourine AND sing at the same time .

How much to charge depends on how long you have been around and how well you are known as well as the area you work in. If you are just starting up you may want to charge a little less as an 'introductory offer' make your employer feel they are getting a bargain. Then, if you deliver you can work out a deal. The prices stated by babs sound good to me.

Hope this helps.

It has been a long time since I performed but when I did, I charged $75 per set. Aset consisted of about 12 songs and with small talk between songs, each set lasted roughly an hour. I knew lots of musicians in those days (early 1980s) and they were the people who told me sets consisted of 12 songs. I pretty much did 3 sets per gig but ofetn times did as many as four because I was having a good time as well as the people listening. How many sets (hours) do you do per gig and how many songs do you typically do per performance? I read here somewhere that one person does between 60 and 70 songs a night and I am wondering if many of you sing that many songs in one night?

Thanks for what you are sharing so far, it is being very helpful in helping me determine if Cds are the way for me to get back on stage and perform.

Contact Mr. October on this site, see what he's using.

I perform with cdgs on a regular basis.  Have not had any complaints.  I charge on what I think I can get depending on who and where I will be performing.  Generally speaking I think about 200.00 a gig is fair usually 3 or 4 hours, with a 15 or 20 minute break every hour.  Hope this helps you.  Sincerly Glen.

As far as sets go It depends on the venue and your vocals. I know after
3 sets my voice is usually done for the night, so if they want me to go longer
I'll try to stretch it out with easier songs. I don't count songs in a set as much as time.
(45min. singing - 15 min. break) Give or take a few minutes including banter with the crowd.

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[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

I do a character show starting off with Sinatra and the Rat pack standards in coustume, the move up through the years per set changing costumes for each set.

I have a woman who loves to sing so she will sing when I take breaks. she does this for free.

Through help from KNIGHTSHOW I have aquired the knowledge of ripping CD+G's to my lap top. I usually Burn new custom disc's for each set of each new show. for my self and Janice.

These set's will consist of aprox 10 to 15 songs per set for me. aprox 20 to 30 min per set.

Janice will sing for 7 or 8 songs. per set. ( my Break)

burning custom disc's means no dead air time, no fumbeling around looking for disc's.

I produce like I said earlier new disc's for each show no two shows are the same.

the show is non stop from 8pm to 12am.
We have a very nice following and get asked to do many party's,
My "Home Base" for the MrOctober show is in a nice Upscale Lounge and the audiance average age is 35 and up.
Im booked the first wed of each month. (for over a year and a half now)
I have a great day job for the last 22 years and dont need the money made from this show to live, so the show money goes into top line equipment.

Pro's of using CD instead of Band's
1. I couldnt afford a band that could play the veriety of Music we sing.

2. the CD's allways show up with me on time.

3. If janice cant make it it's no big loss. Ill play filler music.

4. I dont have to split the Take with anyone

5. the people get many different dance styles thru the night not just rock n roll.
   I have people that waltz to "Volare", twist to the beatles, and line dance to some  
   country Janice will throw out there.


I use a BOSE L1 Personal  Amplification System  (google it)
Cordless and Corded Mic's
RSQ single Tray CD+G Player
for now a Berringher 6 Channel mixer   ( Mackie on the way)


My crowd enjoy's the show. ofcourse live bands are more "Live Sounding"
however you can carry on a conversation without yelling to eachother during my show's.

I poll the crowd at every show I do, as to what types or what kind of music they like or liked hearing during my show.
The big Yes'es are Neil Diamond, Sinatra and the Standards. and most of all the 70's and 60's.  It wouldnt go over big if I started Rapping or doing Pearl Jam or something like that.

It is a lounge act and it works for me.

and just to make sure you dont think I dont take care of Janice.....I do.
But she is not in on the contract. she does it because she likes to be on stage.
there are some live takes from my show on singers showcase ( in my profile there) altho they are early recordings. Ive gotten better and a few pic's in my album.

good luck with your show Im sure youll have more fun doing it with disc's than putting up with four or five different personalities to pull off a good show consistently.

if I can help in anyway let me know.
Michael

Thanks everyone, you're being very helpful! You've been very encouraging.

Another question completely unrelated but will have to be dealt with too. What about stage fright? If you suffer from stage fright how severe is it and how do you overcome it?

People think I am totally relaxed and comfortable on stage while in reality I freak out prior to going on stage and for the first few songs I feel extremely tense and nervous; to the point that everything seems blurred and hazy (and I don't even drink) and I can barely get my body to move. I usually start singing and thinking about what people are thinking about the song/my singing/the way I am dressed etc... Honestly, I get such severe stage fright that I amaze myself sometimes that I do get up on stage at all; and sometimes the anxiety builds to the point where I feel that I am going to become sick.

I have never gotten it that bad and honestly after so many years of doing it
I rarely get nervous now.

I think we build ourselves into a frenzy. What I would do is feed off the nervous tension. Part of it is an adrenlin rush you are feeling. I would tell myself to enjoy the rush. It is like a temporary high. If you can bring yourself to thinking you like feeling the excitement of nrevous tension instead of fearing it, that might help. I don't know it used to work for me. It is all so psychological.

I do believe the longer you do it the more comfortable you'll get.

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Thanks Babs.

Stage fright has always been my enemy. It is hard to explain the feeling that I go through; my heart beats so hard I swear I can hear it. I have been on stage several times throughout the years, sometimes several times week after week and it seems the feeling of stage fright never deminishes. I have to fight it every step of the way to the stage. What is surprising is that after about three songs I feel right at home on the stage and have a blast.

I have a friend (he knows sound systems) looking for what will work best for me. I am lucky in that I have so many people who support me and encourage me to perform.

Thanks MrOctober, that was a lot of information you gave and I appreciate it!

My wife, her sister, and their father and his wife preform in a vocal group that uses CDG tracks.  It has become a lucrative business over the last 5 years or so (they started about 11 years ago).  We (I run the sound), a lot of the shows we do are in venues that can't hold a band, or in places that don't want to spend a lot on a band.  WE do a lot of gigs for business parties and a few wedding receptions here an there.  Our busy time is nov-jan.  We also get booked for a few town celebrations in the summer to.



No, they don't feel cheated.  First off they know what they booked, we are not a BAND.  In fact I think it is better.  Bands (at least in my area) have about 50-100 songs they can perform, and are usualy all of the same genre/time.

As for our "BAND", each of the 4 singers takes turns with the lead vocal, and with each person can perform about 100+ songs from all times and genres, it give the crowd more of a variety.  We do make the sets up before hand, but since the sound comes from the laptop, if changes are needed (request, add more country songs for a country crowd, ect...) it is done with the click of the mouse.  


A 4 hour show (4 sets: 45 mins sing/15 min break) usualy goes for $800.  If club type lighting is wanted, we tack on an extra $200.  After expenses, we all usualy end up with $150-$200 per show.  It is not a lot, but at the end of the night, there are always a lot of free drinks, and it is a hell of a lot of FUN!

Twansenne - working with a group of singers like that sounds great.
I would love to have another person with me just because my poor voice takes a
beating. What a variety too. I would much rather listen to a group like that than a band. Of course I'm more into singers than intruments.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

hey at least on the cd, the drummer keeps a steady beat and you don't have to worry about him getting drunk and falling off his stool....

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I serve no man and am loyal to only one God.

Being critical of a person's success in any respect speaks volumes about the lack of your own.

Love as though you've never been hurt, Dance as though no one's watching, Sing as though God Himself were listening.

Or the guitar player jumping off the stage , splitting his pants,
and pulling the amp over because his cord didn't reach that far.
TRUE STORY  LMAO

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[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

I played in live bands until about two years ago when my last band broke up.  Our bass player suggested that we form a duo using CDs as the rest of the band.  I was resistant at first because it didn't seem like we were really "making music".

It took a little getting used to but now that I've been doing it for a while I like it.  We both sing.  I play guitar and my partner plays a stand-up bass.  I do most of the lead vocals and that's mostly because he really likes to sing harmony.

We average playing 2 to 3 weekends per month throughout the year.  We would like to have a set fee but in reality it depends on how much our manager can negotiate.  At this point our minimum is $300 per night for clubs/bars.  We're getting $350 at most places.  We do private parties, mostly for $400 and we suddenly seem to be doing a lot of those.  New Year's Eve last year we got $600 and I expect the same this year.

We do a four hour show which consists of three 1 hour sets and two 30 minute breaks.  

We promote ourselves as a "band" but make no secret of the fact that there are two of us and that we use pre-recorded music in the background.  This is supported by the photo and other information on our promo material.  Last year we recorded a CD so we could give owners a chance to hear what they were getting.  

Our material is primarily 50's through 70's classic rock & roll and R&B.  We throw in a little 80's and 90's stuff if it fits our definition of rock & roll and if we can do it without sounding or looking stupid.  

My partner rips cdg's from our collection of songs and burns custom sets.  While the sets are fixed we are constantly learning new stuff and each set is pretty much a work-in-progress at any given time.  It's a hassle to keep burning new CDs but we feel it keeps the show fresh and we are constantly strengthening our set list.  We use a multi-tray player so handling requests out of the order of our set list is a matter of pressing a button or two and very little time is wasted.

During a typical night we do somwhere in the neighborhood of 60 songs.  My partner is one of the funniest people I know so he is really our front-man.  I play straight-man and there are nights when we are as much a comedy show as we are a music show.  Some of our stuff is preplanned and some of it is improvised as we work off of the audience or each other.

At this point we have our regular three sets, an additional CD with what we call our "extras" which is about 90 more minutes of material and a 5th CD with the stuff we've been working on over the past several weeks.  That's got another 60 minutes or so of music.  So altogether we've got about 5 1/2 hours of material available for the three hours we play.  And as I said we're constantly adding to that.  We can mix and match all of this material or just stick to our set list.  What we do depends on where we are, crowd repsonse, requests and sometimes just on how we feel.  If one of us gets the urge to do a song that's not on the set lists we just do it.  

We've never had any complaints.  Quite the contrary, some of our success seems to stem from the flexibility we have because we're not chained to a band of a set size.  When we're doing a Buddy Holly song we're a 4-piece rock & roll band.  When we're doing a Blues Brothers song we're a 12-piece R&B band.  One of our other strengths is that we can play in smaller places where a larger band wouldn't fit.  That inhibits the amount of money we can charge but in our area there are fewer venues every year.  And most of what I would call true clubs are a thing of the past.  There are two bands around that area that are 12-piece bands.  At this point there are only 3 places large enough to fit them and knowing what most bands are getting I can imagine that they probably don't each make more than $30 per night.  We work a lot more than a number of the bigger name bands around our area.

I've done a lot of solo work over my career and all things considered I find it much more enjoyable to work with at least one other person.  A few months ago my partner spent some time in the hospital and I did several shows by myself.  I could do it and we even got some additional gigs from those shows.  But it wasn't the same and I know that we are far better together than I am alone.  I also really enjoy the flexibility of being whatever size band we need to be for a particular song.  

I am beginning to wonder if this kind of thing won't be much more common in the future.  In our area people don't follow bands like they used to.  That has a lot to do with Wisconsin's restrictive drunk driving laws.  So it's much more of a neighborhood business than it used to be.  Big places are becoming very scarce and the economics have changed considerably too.  So I suspect we're in this to stay.  But, as mroctober says, there isn't anyway to shout, "one more time" at the end of song.

If you want an idea of what we're up to you can go to our website at:  

http://www.looking-back.net

Our promo information is on the site and there is a juke box that has 8 of the songs from our CD on it.

I hope you find this helpful.

Larry

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Thanks for all the help. I do like the idea of not having to worry about dealing with all the hassles of a band. Some replies were very detailed and I appreciate it. The more I read the more I can see wher doing shows with a CD is benificial.