Karaoke Forums

So, who is going home tonite.  I think it shoud be Elliot.  He has no range, his vibrato is over done, and he dosen't look the part of a American Idol.

Chris should have won it, but with who is left now, it should be Kat!  When Taylor come out with an album, I WILL BUY IT!

woops I'm an idiot I meant vote Elliot and voted Kat. Sorry

I'm going on record saying my vote to win it is Kat. You guys can rub it in when
Taylor wins.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Should we East coast folk that will be watching it in an hour wait until midnight prior to voting ?

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I think Elliot will be gone tonight, HOWEVER there is a chance that some of Chris' disgruntled fans (not saying that Chris encourages this) may vote to keep Elliot on just to sabotage the chances for Kat or Taylor.

I have a question.  But I will keep my mouth shut until all you on the West Coast have had a chance to watch AI.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I have never heard of an election or poll that was as close to how this turned out to be!  The margin of error should call for this three way race to be done all over again.  A 0.1% difference between the three contestants is just bizarre. But anyway, Elliot was an incredibly gracious loser.  Even Chris a couple weeks ago gave that blank look with undertones of "what the h**l,  I lost?"  This latest result really has to be a hollow victory for Taylor and Kathrine!

Hooters will prevail (.)(.)

Just my 2 Cents

Did you fall for those numbers? Come-on, it's a marketing stunt, nothing else.

_________________
Money is better than poverty, if only for financial reasons.

Something didn't seem right to me.   Assuming you lost, and just got the news you weren't one of the two finalist's, would YOU feel like singing a song at that point ?   They tell Elliot, (who incidently did a VERY difficult jazz type song and was an excellent vocalist yet they were all pretty good IMHO) that he didn't make the finals, and give him the microphone to sing an "Exit song" ?  WHO feel's like singing right after being told "you lost", despite the close margin. What if he wasn't "so gracious", this is ALL fixed, the purpose of this show is to form celebs by the little skits, it's a marketing ploy aimed at the younger female viewer, and some males too who fall for these "Joe nobody kids, and because they saw them form on TV, they want to support their hero...Look at all the money this program pours on it's skit's with the kids in the Mayor's mansions, parading thru the streets and suddenly a girls their with a huge woodchuck on her shoulder, cops are escorting these kids out've limo's...this is ALL marketing. The show needs to turn out Stars, that's there goal... When the speaker came out, and stated..

"Since 2001 when we first aired, skeptics told us we'd just be another talent show that didn't turn out people that broke into the music industry. We proved them wrong"

So really, what's the goal of this program that spends LOADS of money with props, and large city political figures, and famous actors and actresses in large cities ?, as well as publicity stunts ? My own thoughts are this show is either closely linked with the music industry to begin with, it's subliminally forming stars in the eyes of millions of viewers it KNOWS will buy particular kids albums before they even make the cuts, It's duping the audience.. The shows sheer rating among a younger age bracket brings in so many viewers, that it's hyping the viewers to see these amateurs as celebs, and like Melrose place, and Beverly Hill's 90210 a kid get's a guitar for his birthday, composes a song on the program.... and every 17 year old girl viewer and her brother runs to Walmart wanting their "idol's" song.... Hollywood is making it's own market.... The program is creating it's OWN market, it's pouring loads of money into creating IDOLS. Great psychological means of marketing for the music industry,, The producers KNOW what they are doing  :)

My own feelings,  THESES kids KNOW before the show who's going to win, and lose... It's ALL fixed ALL along the program, this isn't an actual talent contest, it's more an Aaron Spelling type production... Stats aren't real, nobody would know otherwise, how could they know this is fixed ?  This show pours out LOADS of money and is closely linked with the music industry now-adays, and it's goal is to turn out MONEY making kids only,  not kids that win, and decide to go to college the following month and become Atty's.... It forms it's own market by the acting that takes place on the program and the fluff, and glitz, the scenes you see are the show, not the singing, as well as it's excessive drama.  This is a primetime program, NOT a talent show... It's ALL fixed !!  The judges are only allowing kids to get to the point of the finals they know can be sold to the viewer who's getting turned onto these kids by the acting in the program, and the "stay tuned for the continuing episode of Kat and Taylor, this is a primetime TV show hooking the viewer...

It's marketing kids knowing kids will buy them... It's all a marketing stunt aimed at turning the right kid into stars, kids the entertainment industry KNOWS will be popular, it psychologically hooks the viewer to like them. It's a TV show with actors and actresses,  only in this case hollywood is picking it's actors and actresses that incidently can or maybe can't sing..from kids that audition and get cut along the way...

It's some talent,  and ALOT of marketing and psychology !  THe kids that make the show are determined by judges (who are actually talent scouts) who know very well who is marketable on primetime TV

JMO...

Talent-wise,  these kids are all pretty good, and quite marketable,  My guess is alot would depend on age-bracket viewing as to who wins, assuming it weren't fixed.. This was the first time I watched the whole show, and I felt as though I was getting subjected to a marketing stunt !  

I did like that big furry woodchuck sitting on the girls shoulder when they were in the Alabama parade marching to the mayors place however. DO you know how much subliminal advertising is going on here ???  My own feeling is a more appropro name for this show would be "American VIewer mind control"...

It was a cute show. but BORING....

(I did like that woodchuck,  how many of you even noticed it  LOL    )

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I think you are on the right track, but not completely correct. If you read the fine print in the credits, the PRODUCERS do the voting all the way down to the final 12 (even though they protray it as the judges doing the voting), then let the telephone votes go at it from there.

Once they get to the final 12, however, they have 12 almost can't miss singers up there, then they are simply probing for which one the viewing audience likes the best and will therefore sell the best.

Also, it is pretty well documented that once these contestants get to the Hollywood portion of the show, they are required to sign a contract basically signing their likeness, songs, and life away to the production company. During the big lawsuit Kelly Clarkson had with AI, they said that she was required by a contract she signed prior to the Hollywood round of the show to waive all rights to her songs and likeness to the production company AND give them about 85% of profits from any album sales regardless of if she won the show or not. After winning the show, she was contractually obligated to produce 2 albums with an option for the 3rd with a large % of the profits going to the AI production company. When she sued to get out of this contract after the first album, she pretty much lost but AI let her buyout the contract, which was probably a good move for Kelly considering her independent debut sold 3.8 million copies last year.

ALSO, these kids are all required to tour for a year with the AI tour AND past winners/favorites are required to return to the show at the producer's whim, though it is usually to promote the album AI is pimping that week.

So all in all, I think you are getting a sincere show on the surface, but a very shrewd business behind the scenes that really milks these kids for all they are worth...

_________________
C Mc
KJ, FL

Now this makes LOADS of sense   Yeah,  I didn't read any print, but as you say, up to the final 12, how many kids have gotten cut in the local auditions all the way up ?  The 12 finalists are ALL kids that are marketable, and likely have other contracts in terms of reading scripts, dressing certain ways, since most of this is a TV show.. not a talent contest at this level..

JMO...

The phones might be ringing, but do we know even THAT'S not all props ?  Who would possibly know whether or not the results were rigged or not ?  If our country can rig presidential votes, can't hollywood rig "American Idol" ?


Anyway,  at this level basically, they all won  :) IMO

That was no easy song Elliot did for his CD... They are all talented kids however.

How many millions does Hollywood pour into each of these episodes ?  I can't believe at this level of programming it's not fixed, and acted out.  That shows a very powerful marketing stunt..  I did feel like I was watching an Aaron Spelling production tho...

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Wow Kappy I was wrong - you got a lot out of watching one show.  LMAO
I agree - they are enslaving these kids in contracts from day one. It really bothers me that this is going on. I suppose though I would sign one too if I had the chance to get that experience and exposure. It is just a shame. Isn't Simon and the gang rich enough?

The show fixed. I don't think so. If it was Chris would still be in it.

Simon and the people that are affilliated with the show have huge music contacts
that could make anyone a star. They are signed to a well known record label, have the best people grooming them, and have the advantage of tv exposure for weeks.
Plus you have america chosing who they want to hear. Aren't those the people who will buy the cds. Why take the chance of losing it all by fixing the results.

By the way did you see they fixed Elliot's teeth?

The reason the voting in my opinion is so close- you can only call for 2 hours after the show. Have you ever tried? I have. The lines are busy constantly, you are lucky if you get through at all. There are only so many calls that can come through in 2 hours. I'm surprised they didn't all have the same amount of votes. Now if I got through everytime I'd know every vote got counted and there was room for there to be no callers. I know if a bunch of people tried to call my phone line for an hour (with no dead time)and I picked up everytime it rang. I would only get so many calls in that hour.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

AND,  What's to stop the same person from calling and calling and calling within that same two hour period  :)





I haven't watched enough to know, but would that necessarily be the case in a fixed program ?  Perhaps they'd throw in a twist.  Remember, adding some "controversy" or "always keep them guessing", as if it's anyones guess who'll win is all part of twists that keep the viewer coming back for more..


JMO.  (I really don't know, the show looked tremendously staged or canned to me). Out've the hour, HOW much of their singing on the show did you see ?   4 songs done on the show ?  How much of the show was appearances of large city governer's, celebs, and props such as limo's, and extravagance ?  most of it... Yet who's getting fooled by all this ?   The viewer.

This is the way I look at it Babs, and I might be incorrect, but a show that is spending millions per episode, and going thru such efforts, isn't going to take the chances of having one of those kids end up saying... "This sucks, you guys are all a bunch of idiots, I shoud've won", and then have the kid end up spitting at everyone.  Think about it, how can they NOT have editing capabilities ?  If you knew these kids, and they were open and honest with you, do you think they'd possibly say,

"THat's not what really happened, the real stuff got edited out?  We reheased and spent hours and hours in wardrobe, makeup, and redoing parts, I was an actor for a few weeks"

They spend ALOT of money on props, and setting up a "Lifestyles of the rich and famous" type atmosphere.. Too much money to not script the end... or redo ends that aren't to their liking.. Who's really controlling the outcome of this show ?  Can anyone believe the writers, and staff of AI doesn't have most of the say ? These ends are the culmination of LOADS of money and ratings... They aren't going to risk a kid doing something that isn't appropriate... or to their liking...


While they want you to think it's about "the kids, and talent",  I think it's about the show, and it's ratings, and kids who can (or can't) sing being made by the show.. The better the ratings, in conjunction with the "presentation" will sell these kids too...
If every 10 minutes, they broke away, and showed me at home typing in here, I'd be a marketable prop too... Like another Larry Bud Melman... The display, and presentation is what's selling.  Sell the show to the public, and the show will sell the public stars...What you don't pay much attention to for the most part is all the bell's and whistles.... That's hype for these kids... It's not a talent program,  That's the theme... These are short novels on the kids rise and fall too and from stardom... It's a TV show.  That's all...

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

They encourage everyone to call as many times as they'd like. It doesn't
seem to be a perfect way of counting votes. I definately agree with that.
As far as it being staged I'm sure they try to control it as much as possible.

Did you ever see the movie where they rigged a game show? They got caught giving the guy the answers to the questions, so he would win everytime. This was a true story and as far as I know after that happened there were strick guidelines and watch dogs for these kind of programs. These people on the show are making plenty of money. Why would they take the chance of getting caught and going to jail?  I just don't see the motivation to rig the show. Are things done fairly - no. But I don't think there is anything illegal going on.

I guess what it comes down to is - In my mind it is fair enough. I enjoy the heck out of watching each week. I love the idea of someone having the chance to make it in this business that no one would have ever known about otherwise. who knows if we
had AI sooner maybe it would be Charmin up there.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Yep Bab's,  That rigged quiz show is a famous movie.. Of course I can't think of the name currently...  LMAO .  But it's WELL known. I'm inclined to think for some reason that's the actual name of the show

"Quiz Show", and it was remade in the mid 1990's, regarding dishonesty in the 1950's on a quiz show  :)


Regarding talent shows,  they've always been around... "Star Search",  "Showtime at the Apollo", etc..


This is from TV new 2003

'Star Search' Takes Cues from 'American Idol'
By Brill Bundy
Sunday, January 12, 2003
10:00 PM PT

Those who have noticed similarities between CBS' updated "Star Search" and FOX's summer hit "American Idol" aren't mistaken. "Star Search" Executive Producer Andrew Golder readily admits that they were influenced by what came before them and hope that they have learned and improved on some of "Idol's" elements, especially the use of the judging panel.
"It was an interesting part of 'Idol' to hear what the judges had to say, and why they were doing what they did," Golder says. Still, even though it was captivating television, Golder found it unfulfilling that the judges didn't really matter as to the show's outcome after the first few episodes.




/>While "American Idol" has made judge Simon Cowell a star, "Star Search" went the more conventional of having celebrity judges from the get-go, including Jack Osbourne, Ben Stein and Naomi Judd. Not only do they get to air their opinions on the performances, their ratings count for half of the total, with call-in and Internet votes from viewers at home accounting for the rest.
"We wanted to keep the judges really an integral part of this and make what they had to say count throughout," Golder says. "Watching ['Idol'] certainly made us and made everyone realize that there is real entertainment value you can get from these people. In a sense they sort of become characters."

CBS' "Star Search" airs on Wednesdays and Thursdays at 8 p.m. ET.


RELATED NEWS
CBS Continues 'Star Search'; 'Presidio,' 'Supreme' Yanked
Jan 28, 2003
'Star Search' Host Says Rappers Can't Compete
Jan 13, 2003
'Bachelorette' Leads Wednesday Reality Pack
Jan 09, 2003
'Star Search' Picks Its First 16
Jan 06, 2003
Arsenio Hall to Host 'Star Search'
Dec 20, 2002

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Oh no!  It can't be rigged!  Now I suppose you're going to tell me that George Bush didn't really win two Presidential elections by just a few thousand votes!

If it weren't rigged,  maybe we'd have a few actual Presidential candidates for a change.  I'm thinking of running against Sam Berkowitz 2008


I guess they've resurrected the mid 1980's "Star Search" that was hosted by Ed McMahon

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

It's a scary world when "Reality TV" becomes our president sitting in a courtroom being asked questions about cigars, and extramarital sexual acts with interns.. Who then becomes the laughing stock of the world  


Our nation..

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

First off, let's all agree that none of this AI stuff is really of any importance at all.  But it does give us all something to watch and argue about.  

So Steven, If this really is all rigged and it's all a marketing ploy to sell product to young kids, why is Chris gone and Taylor is still in the top two?  Chris would have much more appeal to the teens.  These facts don't really mix well with the "rigged/pre-planned" theory.

Since I never saw Chris,  I can't honestly answer this question Don.. But I can speculate     Maybe the writing staff had an MO for having the star take a dive  :).
Isn't Taylor more "soulful" ?? Perhaps less of a rocker ?  While some found Elliot over the top,  I thought he was quite talented,  even tho his vibrato was abit too much for me,  they could easily work with that in the industry... MAYBE they want the girl to win  :shock:  "Always keep them guessing"... Perhaps Chris's winning was too predictable.  Assuming Chris won,  people would say... "Why watch next time" we know who the winner is,  I'll just tape it instead of watching it.

Perhaps I don't know what I'm talking about... Thing is,  I saw how much money they poured into that show.... It's staged !  The kid's are likely told WHAT clothing to wear.  Designers of the show's sponsors, etc..


I look at that program as a super bowl that contains 4 minutes of football, and 45 minutes of halftime activity using the players as the entertainment.  How can they all not win ?  Everyone and everything seen on that show becomes celeb status in lieu of the enormity of the viewing audience....  I'm now a fan of that woodchuck

Here's how presentation works..
I can't get that damn song "You had a bad day" out've my head... and I only heard it once..

This show is loaded with subliminal props ads, and all sorts of stuff.   You can write a thesis on advertising psychology based on that one hour show..

Now while I never saw Chris,  I heard descriptions.  When I heard these three sing last night, I closed my eyes and turned away because I wanted to just HEAR THEM.  I didn't want to get hoodwinked by any props, and stage presence.  THese were ALL extremely talented individuals, and likely the ONLY difference as to who would win is the viewers age, location, preferences for style, music, etc..  Would 13 year old or 9 year old girls want chris too ?  I don't know... Assuming it's not fixed that is... I thought out've the three last night, Elliot performed his own Jazz song that was more sophisticated than the others (at least that I heard in my one viewing)..  I feel Elliot won based on difficulty factor, and sophistication of his rendition... Yet that's me, How many that watch this show,  really can tell who's better than whom ?  What is selling, the character ?  or the singing

The show hooks the viewers, and the viewers even get me going

Or could it be..... I'm NOW HOOKED  (music from Twighlight Zone playing)

{{{{{{{{{{{{{{ ^00^ }}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}



In Brief;

Don,  I don't know.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".