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OK...a little background.  My ex-fiancee and I went through A LOT last year.  Basically, in the space of three weeks, I went from having a live-in fiancee pregnant with my child to having NONE of the above.  She lost the baby, moved out, and we split...almost all at once.

I knew she had found another guy...and I worked on getting over it.

About 3 weeks ago, she calls me..."just to talk".  Well, we've been talking again ever since...about how bad her bf is to her, where we went wrong, etc.  We've both said there's NO WAY we're getting back together...

But in the last three weeks, she's spent more time with me than her bf.  Which makes me realize that I can't be THAT BAD, obviously...it's just starting to feel REALLY weird.

Heck...she called me this morning, talking to me about her girl's night out last night, and the guys that were hitting on her and her friend...

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

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Oh, I know becoming friends again is a good thing.  Hell, we communicate better now than we did six months ago  It's just kind of insane that we've gotten along so well recently after such a bad split.  I honestly NEVER expected to hear from her again.

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

if i can be seroius here for a sec, squid.

being pregnant is hard enough on a couple, but losing a child is hard on everybody, the mom, the dad, the grandparents, everyone, even friends because they care about you.  one of my very best friends and his wife lost their baby just before the holidays.  they've been married a LONG time and have a solid marriage, but even they had alot of trouble during that period.  my wife's cousin and her husband lost their baby early last year.  their marriage was strong, but they hyad thier problems.  losing the baby actually helped them become closer.  every person will deal with that situation in a different way.  you and your ex-fiance obviously cared for one another a great deal to be
1- live-in
2- engaged
3- pregnant

you didn't say how long you'd been together beforehand, but i'd assume it was a while.  maybe she's dealt with her end of the issue.  if you have as well, take things slow and see where it goes.  i'm sure there were alot of things said, probably in the heat of the moment when you were breaking up and those can't be taken back, but i'm sorry goes means alot when you realize that it's sincere and you understand why they were said.  sorry to make a long drawnout deal of this, but i like to see everyone happy, no matter what it is that makes them that way.  if i can lend insight to help them, so be it!

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All work and no play make Homer something something

That's one of the other good things to come out of the last three weeks...a TON of insight.  We finally got to talk about a lot of stuff.  

I also think that she finally gets that I was serious when I said all I wanted was for her to be happy...even if it wasn't going to be with me.  She "hid" the new bf from me...said she didn't want to hurt me...she was surprised when I laughed and said "Good for you...I've been exploring my options too"

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

sounds like y'all may be on the right track.  congrats!  :handshake:

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All work and no play make Homer something something

From what you said, (and I'm not about to get into much in here because what you'll find is intense subject's of this nature shortly end up under attack on the internet,  in a venue of this type. Just the nature of how thing generally are)...

You appear to be at the "receiving end" of this relationship. Meaning (even though the loss of a child is an extremely high stressing factor on ALL couples) there's another aspect here besides that loss. YOU and YOUR feelings as a person (and partner) rather than an ex-partner who's reacting to something that's happening on the other partners terms.  She's "looking back"... Remember during turmoil in a present relationship, MANY look back at past relationships, the past often becomes a safe haven during difficult times for most.  



and when that becomes tough for her, rather than work on those difficulties, she comes back to you temporarily ?   There's more to this.  Noone know's the intricacies of your relationship. From your description I do know this.

*

    SO did you !

*

     You lost ALOT in a short time.

You need a REAL AND LOCAL councelor, not people on the internet. The fact that you are asking this in here means it's weighing heavily on your mind. These are VERY REAL, and VERY INTENSE issues for anyone. Please ponder seeing a Social Worker in real,  the internet isn't the place to be asking this.. *YOU* lost ALOT too !
You need some help sorting things out, There's a mourning process that you might never have delt with properly, and there's also these others aspects of *HER* whims, and your feelings camouflaged within ALOT of clutter..

I won't advise on the internet, I will suggest seeking REAL help..

                          Good Luck, and take care of #1 first !

Just being honest !

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

ditto Steven! tht is great advice!

although just to clarify i wasn't trying to be anything more than a sympathetic shoulder.

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All work and no play make Homer something something

Thanks, Kappy.  I am seeing a counselor.

And yes, there is a LOT more to all of this.  Just helps to vent it out and bounce it off other people.  Ah, well...

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

All perspectives gladly taken on board.  I'm an equal-opportunity listener

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

Steve, I know.


I also know that beneath this question there's alot of emotion, and hurt.

Not criticisizing ANY supportive advice that's been offered thus far..

Just reminding folks that certain aspects exceed the capabilities of what can be, and should be offered in this type of room.  Certain aspects of our lives aren't appropriately placated by those that don't know us.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I think you need to do more of the talking to your counselor so you can deal with your feelings and emotions... It doesn't really matter what any of us think...It is all about you and healing yourself.  

I know you are a good listener...you have listened to me babble on and on before.....it's your turn..talk talk talk.....

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Will sing or fish for food!!I'm not quite right!!

You've heard me go off on a rant or two in person, too.

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

Don't know about you guys, but I don't think it's ever a good idea for anyone to go backwards...You heard me almost do it with my second wife last month, but I sobered up emotionally and thought better of it.

Move forward.......Yeah, work on being a better you, but never look back.

She is looking for a safe place...........The world is full of people looking for a safe place..........Find a gal who is safe and secure already without you, but wants to be with you and treats you special.

She lost the child, she left you, she found an abusive boyfriend, now she wants to come back to you........Man, you lost the child too, then you lost her, and now you are seeing a counselor trying to deal with it all, and on top off all that, she wants to come back!..............You don't need the drama!

You know what counselors do?....If they are good, they pull your head out of your butt.

You know how you get your head stuck up your butt to start with?....By chasing your tail over her.

She had you chasing your tail in ever-deminishing circles til you had your head stuck firmly up your butt....So, once you and the counselor get it pulled out, take a breath of fresh air, and head off in a direction that is good for you.....Don't go backwards....If you like drama, watch the soaps....Don't live them.

Oh, and once you start marching smartly in a direction that's good for you, you will become very attractive to the opposite sex.........Don't slow your pace or change your direction for any of them.....Just keep marching smartly and see if any can keep in step with you and most importantly, not try to steer you back in circles.

The only looking back I've been doing is trying to learn from my mistakes with her.  And I FIRMLY believe that if I can't learn from my history, I'm doomed to repeat it.

We're NOT back together in any sense...just talking as friends.  I not only want HER to be happy, I want to be happy myself...and with her, it would be impossible.  That said, she's still somebody I loved, and still care about...and being the guy I am, I can't help but TRY and be friendly toward her.

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

Yep, I understand.................This second wife of mine, I am once again attractive to her because I got my direction back after we divorced.........She didn't destroy me like has a few others she's known...I am just a safe place for her because it looks like I got my act together and she once again needs security.

So that is why she is calling and coming to visit. ...I like the visits fersure cause she is 20 years younger than me and hot, but you can believe I ain't going back to her....Nope, I got places to go and things to do.

I'm glad we are still friends tho....I really enjoy her company....She was the best fishing buddy I ever had and it looks like we will be doing that again soon, but there is no way I will invest emotionally in her again....There is no way I will risk my future and my dreams for me with her again.

This other gal that has been calling and emailing and that everyone is nagging me to date.......No way!...She is just looking for a safe place.........She ain't looking at me for who I am, she just needs a safe place.

My cousin and her husband lost their child, they broke up within a year.  Plus a good friend of mine and his wife also lost two of their children in a automobile fire.  The kids got into the car and played with matches.  Their marriage didn't last two months.

My friends wife left him and remarried someone else about a year later.  About six months later he started receiving phone calls from her just about every night and sometimes several times a day.  Eventually she left her new husband and went back to my friend.  I actually thought that they were going to make it, but that didn't happen.  They married, they divorced. They went to a counselor and the he was told by the counselor that she was still in the healing process and had just reached out to him for support. My friend would have been a lot better off if she had just skipped him and went straight to the counselor by herself.

As for losing a child - I lost my kevin at the age of twenty-one - Losing a can kill you and your marriage - my wife made it through the difficult time, but we both think about it every day of our lives.  That was ten years ago and there are still times that when I come home from work I'll find her sitting on the couch crying.

You just have to ask yourself - I'm I being used for moral support.

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Singing just for you

THANK YOU

You, unfortunately, are the perfect example of what so many need to see now a days.

Marriage is a joining of two people against the world...A combining of strengths, not a place where one does all the work.

Losing a child is perhaps the most unnatural and unexpected thing that any married couple can experience....And being such, it can fersure test your ability to face the world together.

Something makes me hope that she doesn't ever cry alone..........

Man, I can always find someone to share the good times with me...It's those bad times when I get lonely and feeling empty..........

I remember once..........Me and the first wife were in Lowes building supply....We were shopping trim materials...I had just finished a long hard job of remodeling our house and we were looking for paint or whatever.....Out of the blue, as we were walking down the isle, she placed her hand on my shoulder....Just rested it there and walked beside me........It was like I was hit with a ton of bricks!....God, it felt good to feel her hand there..........She had never done that before......I was always the strong one who never needed a hand on my shoulder...And she had never offered one.........But it sure felt good when she did it.........After 20 years of marriage I suddenly needed it......I needed it everyday after that........But that must have been a slip I guess cause she never did it again.....So I divorced her finally.

She placed her hand on my shoulder and offered me support and approval....She finally did for me what I done for her for 20 years.....And it felt good!.........It felt so good I wanted more and never got it....She knew how to use her hands on me, but chose not to.........She withheld her love and let me do all the work.

The next one I build for had better know how to use her hands like that....Otherwise I'll build just for me.

Keith,

You, my friend, have a poetic soul.  A literal truth turning into that metaphor so seamlessly...and so true!!

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[glow=white][scroll]Live, laugh, and love today--just in case tomorrow doesn't make it[/scroll][/glow]

The seven wonders of this world were built by Men........That's what we do as Men-we build things.......We build wonderous things in the hope of attracting and keeping a mate.

And we also tear those wonders apart when they fail us....We Men can destroy things with the same energy and creativity we used to build them....And when we feel cheated and made the fool, we can not only destroy what we built, but also ourselves in the process. Our prisons, graveyards and rehab wards are full of Men who destroyed themselves out of anger and revenge.

I finally learned not to destroy me when I watched what I built fall apart or get torn apart..... So yeah, it is fersure poetic....But at least it's not tragic.

When love fails me now a days, I just love myself instead.