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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:29 pm 
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ok What Now @ Wed Jan 11, 2006 12:22 am wrote:
NOT going to enter the same contest milo does, i would lose for sure, her great looks and pretty voice, who would stand a chance?


not to mention allllll the friends i'd bring along to clap for me.....that bothers me too tom....but popularity too often is a big factor in contests....not talent.....

awwwwww billyyyyyyyyyy....so true....so trueeeeeeeee     LMAO  OK, WHAT do you want NOW?  ;)  seriously.....just name it...... :drool:

oops missed your reply steven......i recently redid 'heaven' .... i want you to listen to see if it's any better....i also want to redo that duet billy and i did for you to critique again, buttttt we neglected to save his part and he doubts he could hit that falsetto again and i haveeeeeee to have the falsetto...i think that made the song


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:33 pm 
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Some people like contests.  To each his/her own I suppose.  I never did.  I never liked the feeling of getting my butt kicked.....(well that's not exactly true either)
What were we talking about ?

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:34 pm 
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ok What Now @ Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:22 pm wrote:
NOT going to enter the same contest milo does, i would lose for sure, her great looks and pretty voice, who would stand a chance?


So you refuse to admit PLUTONICALLY that Mr. Kaplan has great looks & pretty voice that you wouldn't stand a chance against? LOL . Not that there's anything wrong with that.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:39 pm 
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Mr. Kaplan has great looks & pretty voice that you wouldn't stand a chance against?  . Not that there's anything wrong with that.  



Oh YEAH,  there's plenty wrong with that...assuming an audience thinks Billy doesn't stand a chance against MY voice...  Of course some "Deliverance" type of guy would probably think "Kaplan sure has a purty mouf"   :shock:     Anyway,  as I said,  I don't like competitions

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:46 pm 
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Ha! Think the only way out of that would be if you were competing against Ned Beatty in the contest.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:59 pm 
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Can he sing ?  I don't recall,  I never saw "Hear my Song".. where he's portraying some singer ??  (figure this could somehow be a redeeming On Topic Save) LOL

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:07 pm 
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Steven Kaplan @ Tue Jan 10, 2006 9:59 pm wrote:
Can he sing ?  I don't recall,  I never saw "Hear my Song".. where he's portraying some singer ??  (figure this could somehow be a redeeming On Topic Save) LOL


Don't know if he can sing, but he seems to "squeal like a pig" pretty well! Sorry, couldn't help it.


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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:18 pm 
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We'll for him to do that I suppose it took "some coaxing"... Getting back to my singing....well, let's not  <snort>

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PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2006 10:27 pm 
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Anyway,  I need to crash,  take care Billy, Jeanne, Kjchris et al

Between deliverance and gator's,  it might be a bad dream night.

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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 1:33 pm 
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Steven Kaplan @ Wed Jan 11, 2006 1:27 am wrote:
Between deliverance and gator's,  it might be a bad dream night.


or not.....  ;)

what about online contests?  i've only been in one and it was a great experience...a lottttt of hard work though....it was fun though.....we had 3 judges....but the contest was decided by votes and i didn't like that too well...a lot were friendship votes, but thankfully the guy who won it did deserve it IMO....very few of my friends knew i was in the contest....i didn't want their votes to have any influence in my going through to the next level...


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PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2006 5:19 pm 
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Competition isn't an area I've given much thought to. I suppose for the exact same reasons we see problems existing within the ranking and critiquing aspects of Singers Showcase. The problems we run into when "judging others" perhaps, aspect's of the contestants and judges maturity.  Inability for many people to deliniate between "game" and personal affront. I was always an excellent chess player, funny thing is, I was always a horrible competitor.. I suppose like many others, within the course of my upbringing, and education I was trained to win, yet never trained to deal with being average, or coping with being at the "other end" of the competition (when taken as seriously as competition so often is), the losing end.
I suppose the fact is, competition is a game that involves someone winning, other's losing, and others making the determination "who is better than whom", but in what ways ?   Are such determinations limited to the actual game ? Face it, we live in a culture where games are used to displace aspects of stress and reality, but instead the games often are just another venue, or become yet another platform we transfer
other life's problems to... Am I really enjoying a game if those viewing me playing the game are seeing an angry guy slamming around kicking a pinball machine while I'm cursing, and tense ?  Even when I'm winning there's tension...and when I lose, the culmination of the experience often sends me in search of the immediate rompus room where the pinball machine, and my immediate environment seem as though they will have to suffice.

Funniest part is,  these are the activities we resort to for relaxation, and fun...

I suppose people DO sweat the small stuff, and forget how to have fun, take themselves too seriously, etc... The competitive field more than not serves as battle grounds where you can view individual's beating up others, and themselves. A stage where an outside viewer can watch how large children throw more sophisticated tantrums.. Ironically, the competitor's playing the game seem to seldom stop to ask themselves.... Is this really fun for me ? What's happening here ?  Probably because some don't know how to let go and have fun, nor do they ask themselves prior to playing the game,  "am I ready to leave my baggage at the door prior to entering the game rooms?".  Just another example how being an adult physically,  often doesn't mean we've grown up enough to partake in certain activities in a civil manner. Not if we can't relax, and let stuff go.  I for one, am exceptionally self competitive, it's relentless at times.. For this reason game and reality are often bridged.... I might try to cheat on a medical test, thinking I'm winning, or might not take online tests because I'm afraid I'll be average,  something that to me is as bad as failing.... For these reasons, I at least realize I shouldn't be competing with others...I'm not healthy enough.  But how many really are ?

At times it's important to remind ourselves, "I'm here to have fun", SOLELY.. When it's no longer fun, times up. Go elsewhere to try to chill out.  Whether it's Karaoke, online chatrooms, certain things should just be fun for us...
Some are able to deal with competitive "games",  other's of us will buy a slinky.


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...i recently redid 'heaven' .... i want you to listen to see if it's any better....i also want to redo that duet billy and i did for you to critique again, buttttt we neglected to save his part and he doubts he could hit that falsetto again and i haveeeeeee to have the falsetto...i think that made the song


I have a question for you Jeanne,  or anyone for that matter.. I'm curious about this aspect.  When I heard you do the song, I gave it a "10" reason being, IN MY OPINION the song couldn't be done better.. I listened to the KJ Sammy,  DO candlelight rendition, it didn't touch the warmth, and romantic feel of your rendition, to date, I've heard no other versions or performances of that song that have. It could've been YOU doing that song, OR someone I never spoke with or knew...Same ranking HONEST "10" IMO in it's genre, A genre I've worked in most of my life "cocktail lounge style", I ranked that ONLY on performance of THAT song, it did what it was set out to do...it "touched" me as a listener... Your dynamics IMO were exactly on. (for that type song and setting), in such a genre, it isn't "technical" expertise that matter's as much as presentation and accuracy conveying the story. Your ethereal type vibrato fade-out was perfect.. Your mix was ideal given that song. I'm wondering if I should or shouldn't listen to another attempt for "critique" ?.... Personally, I don't know... This is a question *I* raise...I don't know how this does, or should work... You have really really tough competition Jeanne,  your first take. So my question is, If I listen to critique again, I must treat you as a new and independent attempt competing for the 10 rank on a song that already has a 10 correct ?

Given  that, I will listen, yet I might not like it as much as your first version, OR it might be another 10...LOL
Thing is I will need to listen when my head is clear so I can scrutinize...If I have to compare a 10 to another 10 I still have to substantiate my reasons, and compare intricate area's...I need to be of sane mind,  and for me such states only rarely phase in...

The duet, I gave you honest critique on too :)   Looking forward to hearing a remake.  As I vaguely recall it was blend, and balance and style I was yacking about pertaining the duet.  How two communicate within the body of the song..

I used to always get a few opinions on my critiquing abilities in the past..  As with any judging, I'm FULLY accountable for my opinions, and my comment's that affect someone else in an area of art... I learned a few funny things...I sat in as one of the judges in Showtune, and Classical venue competitions awhile back... I learned I don't have enough exposure (even as a musician) to those particular genre's to know what to listen for, or what qualities are preferable... It's interesting to learn about our limitations as those doing the critiquing... It's also VERY important ! IE...I'm not currently sophisticated enough to critique jazz vocals...and as a blues-based musician, not really knowledgable enough in my own genre's vocals to critique and honestly rank the blues vocalist....  

Contestants should really understand that most of these "contests" just involve winning over those making the decisions, often by distracting them, or bluffing them, it's not just about your singing,  Few have enough knowledge to judge a person's ability, these are hack judges... LOL  Most are just sidewalk type foreman that have no real musicianship experience or skill, let alone qualify to assign rank to performances in such an area. That's a skill few judges in these hack contests have... You want a real rank or critique ?  Go to a music conservatory that has reputable musicians familiar with your genre. If you want a real, and humbling experience regarding your classical vocal ability.. Go to Lincoln Center, and have a critique done by a Julliard prof.. LMAO..  I was critiqued by a few Eastman and Hartt prof's, and I didn't really like what they offered me LOL.. I also studied jazz piano for years under John Mohegan as a teen, and when I lived in Fairfield County was in a competition where Dave Brubeck judged me....In college my advisor, and instructor was a Julliard graduate ranked top of his class,  this stuff is REAL life, either you have gotten to a certain level of a skill, or you have not. These individual's can think the world of you as a person, but they will give you an "F" too assuming you flunk the content..It's not who likes you LOL . It's not a fun and pretty situation, it *IS* a learning experience....If you want to get good at something, you're going to get the ^*(%* kicked out of you.. Just the way it is... At one point, you're going to suffer black and blue marks on your ego..If and when you do get to a point where many consider that you excel. You likely will never feel it..because of so many humbling experiences. You also learn that excel of course means even MORE competition, stricter judging of your abilities (since expectations are EXTREMELY high).. Excel is a temporary state...It comes with a history of alot of bruises and hurt feelings.  It's understandible why the best in certain area's, often never plateau to a point where they can bask in their level of accomplishment..

All these other competitions ?    They are JUST to be fun... assuming you can keep that in perspective. Real competition IMHO forces those who normally can't stomach "brutal honesty", to face it...In an honest competition you are shown your place, and it's not negotiable.. Similarly with the "real" critique, if your professor ever writes, or tell's you "DeWd, you are AwSum, a real 10, dang".

You might want to run a check to make sure the prof's diploma wasn't purchased on Ebay.

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PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2006 3:19 am 
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I just want to share one more story regarding contests which in retrospect was kind've funny, yet I suspect sometime down the road, and in retrospect most concerned about ranks in Singer's Showcase today will look back and laugh at themselves...

I sat in front of my first panel of judges in Newark NJ at age 4.. I don't even know how I got involved in that, needless to say it wasn't MY doing... Anyway, they apparently liked what I did....I came home all happy with a plaque, and also knowing what the word "Superior" meant... A year later,  same contest.....I came home not only with the same ranking and plaque,  but that stuff also went to my head.. One year later, (when I was 6) thing's started to change.  My plaque didn't say "Superior", and there was a list of "Critiques", such as

"Elwood,  Steven has a tendency to look down at his fingers while playing"
"When he get's excited he rushes the tempo"
"Steve kept looking over at the judges, yet that's normal for his age, please instruct
him to focus on what he's doing, and not the judge's presence"
"Difficult piece for his age, his concentration was lacking, his fingering needs work"
(with particulars listed of course)  etc...

So the judges said "Very good" son... and on the way to the car, I asked my mom how Very Good compared to Superior.....(My certificate now read "Very Good")

Needless to say I was screaming and bawling for the rest of the day....and wanted to quit....Her explanation..... "Steve, You were superior for your age, now they expect more from you"...

Anyway, the following year I had an attitude and was angry at the judges..  That was the last year I entered. I don't recall the details of that year, but I think my folks had to drag me out... I did tell the judges I don't like them. That's around the time I started seeing a psychologist for the first time.. LOL

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 2:16 pm 
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Geeze Matt,you forgot the 5 gallon gas can with a match stick! ..But I ditto this bigtime.I walkout on the mere mention of the word "contests "when it comes to karaoke.I have never yet seen one that had a "solid set of rules",regs,or fairness.Judges>aka,jury&executioners of no experience on"all genres" of music...and don't give me that audience response C%&* either.I could bring the "whole family" also!...after I exhume their bodies from the earth.I made the mistake of compromising my "metal singing" for a more kinder and gentle approach for these venues,in the hopes to appease audiences and judges,but never again.It's high octane and ram it down from Mon thru Sat,...then church on Sunday.


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