Karaoke Forums

Was just wonderng why what a person rates a song with comment does not appear with their comment. I can see a lot of straight out honesty here if the numerical rating system displayed a number with the comment.

This would end the classic comments like "well this is sure one of my favorite songs, or always liked this one - which totally circumvents the entire purpose of putting up a song for comment - that is not for fluff - but for improvement.

We are in the comment vs. critique arena again, and sniperville. Now, we have been around and around on this. Honesty in rating vs. wanting to be popular. Often, not a good mix. We have also talked up putting up a song for critique and then not wanting it critiqued.

Now my chief COMPLAINT here is a plain vanilla comment, a low rating, and which a completely useless pointless comment to the performer in that he or she has no useful constructive data to improve with or even the honest comment, "I really didn't like this song that much", "your voice needs medical attention".

So why not simply display what a person ranks your song. Why all the stealth?
Would it cause total chaos and many unhappy users to know which people are ranking them with what?

Things have improved.  And I must commend the BRAVE ones who have put their songs up for critique.

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There are no accidents in a perfect world   - Blondie

Jean,  
I'm glad you brought this topic up.  Being new to SS I've been trying to figure out how the comments and ranks go hand in hand.  I have seen very few honest critiques on here which has really held me back from posting any type of criticism.  I've listened to several subs without even leaving a comment and rank just for that reason.
 I've had a couple of suggestions made to me concerning my subs and I appreciate that.  You can't improve if you don't know what people are hearing.  But I'm sure there were many that had a point of view and just didn't express it by the number of views to a sub verses the number of comments.   For example.........on one of my subs I had 12 comments (all positive except for someone letting me know they heard some buzzing at the beginning) but 32 views.....which tells me that there are 20 people out there who probably didn't like it for some reason.  It's these 20 people I would have liked to have heard from also.  It's nice to get the compliments especially if they really liked it.  But I would also like to hear from the ones who don't like it.  I know that sometimes it may just be a different taste in music and that's okay, too.
It will be interesting to see what the other singers say about this topic.
Rita

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[shadow=tomato]If you want your significant other to pay attention to EVERY word you say::
  TALK IN YOUR SLEEP   [/shadow]  

Cindy
That may be the reason, then.  I was unaware that non-members could listen.  I jumped right in when I first found the site...........didn't take but about a day and had to upgrade!  

My singing is just a hobby.  I'm too old to try to do anything with it professionally.  But even with that, I want to improve.  So it would be nice to hear some constructive critism sometimes along with the all the wonderful things.  (But, please don't just tell me "my voice needs medical attention"......) I would think that the ones who are trying to break into the music industry would really welcome the critique as well.   I think only the ones that are marked for rating and critique should receive it though since SS does give us a choice when we sub.

But on the other hand.......I guess people are scared that if they give an opinion like that it would make someone mad and hurt their own rating.  And I'm sure that would happen.  I guess we just aren't as brave as "Simon"........  So there is really probably not a cut and dry answer.

Rita

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[shadow=tomato]If you want your significant other to pay attention to EVERY word you say::
  TALK IN YOUR SLEEP   [/shadow]  

Helloooooooooooooooooooo!!!

'Tis me... The King Of Flirts...!

Anyway... I agree with Shotgun - Non-Members are a big reason that total views are higer... Also remember that some people who commented may listen twice...?

I know I do sometimes if I like a submission...!

32 views with 12 comments is pretty average for me... The only time I REALLY worried was with my most recent sub (which was a while back now as I got busy AGAIN... GRRRR!!!)  But that had around 70 views and only 10 comments, but I am beginning to think maybe there was a glitch or something somewhere...

Anyway - Theres my 2c worth...

Glad to see you Rita... Hope you are enjoying the place and I'll be sure to scheck out your subs... I've just been busy lately

Much love to all,

Brett xxxxxx

Hey CC. I had forgotten about this. And I noticed during one visit there were a LOT of visitors versus members. Something like 17 visitors and 3 members.

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There are no accidents in a perfect world   - Blondie

Now as a senior poster, I have certainly logged many messages on this and it is interesting to hear some feedback from a new user.  Definitely the KS world has changed since we arrived here some months ago. It is a more peaceful place. I must admit it's nice to have some users who just listen for fun and enjoy the music on a purely emotionial basis. It is also a good thing to have a few very polished singers and mixers and performers here who can share constructive thoughts when asked for.

Jee had brought out a point, which really made me think. It was so obvious, but it is simply in this environment one does not have to be a good singer or musician to critique. I find when reading comments, I can think, well there is a nice person that just likes my sub on a purely listening level, here is one that put up solid slick pro material and to make it through their critique is impressive.

I am not hearing an Phil comment on this, which makes me wonder if indeed displaying what people rate you would cause quite a commotion and and conflict.

Anyway, I brought up this topic because it is a little different, and we seem to have made a great deal of progress as far as participation in the rating system to hold a rating.

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There are no accidents in a perfect world   - Blondie

laughs...and makes NO COMMENT  LOL  LOL

I'm one of the folks who thinks individual rankings should be displayed (at least to the submittor), but Phill has already said he wouldn't do that (jvj didn't see that thread).

I, for one, will divulge my ranking to any submittor I rank if they request it. I'm considering just putting my rank in my comments when I rank and let the chips fall where they may.

That is an interesting thought. Kind of like you can't make the world do a certain thing,  you can at least do it yourself. I may start doing this as well.

jvj

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There are no accidents in a perfect world   - Blondie

Well this one is easy to answer. There is little room for honesty if the voters have to display a number next to their comment. Meaning..
voter number 1: Awesome cool performance : 10
voter number 2: This was the best I heard : 10
voter number 3: This was pretty good : rank 8
Now the singer that see's this will think, this SOB must hate me. And before you know it, when that voter with the 8 puts up a song, be sure that you will never ever get a vote back that is above 8 from that person. It is human nature. So anon voting is the best system.

I agree that it would cause some people to rate the other person lower just because they gave a low rank to them or a friend.  
 
I've also noticed since being on here that many of the better singers usually have chosen not to be ranked but leave it open for comment.   I've left all of my songs open for ranking except for one which I did leave open for comment.  Only 7 of the 14 subs show a rating?  Did the listener "prefer not to rank" on those that have no ranking?  All of them except for the one I didn't choose to have ranked had 5 or more comments.  I'm just trying to understand how everything works here.  If I'm rambling tell me to SHUT UP!  

When I first arrived I just chose the ranking because I wanted to get an idea where I fell within the other singers.  I had listened to several super good subs and thought that I was probably out of my league here.   But after being on here for many hours.....
I've also seen that it is a good opportunity to learn new things and work on some things.

I would like to say though that this is the nicest group of people I've ever met on the net!  You Guys and Dolls really make newcomers feel welcome.

 :hug: To All
Rita

Personally- I think it SHOULD go back to showing what people give for a rank. It's kinda two sided though.

It used to show, and you got alot more "patting on the back". Nobody wanted to own up to giving less than a 10, so that's all people usually got &/or gave.

But hiding the ranks only allowed people to be ornery, for the most part. I've heard many say that all their comments are great, but they have an "8 something"..... which means a bunch of people ranked  lower than 10 or maybe ONE person ranked REALLY low. And you're left clueless as to what made it less than what you might have thought it was.  If so many 10's had not always been given- these "8-something" scores would not have shocked people anyhow.

I don't rank, only very rarely, and I haven't been ranked myself for almost a year.  The numbers quit meaning anything to me a long time ago, I never put any stock in them at all.

But if people want to step up and rank, they should be willing to show what score they give and say why. I believe there are enough honest rankers here who would continue to be honest wether their given rank showed or not.  And the non honest ones who are using the hidden system to snipe only- problem solved.

I too like that we can choose to rank or not and to BE ranked or not, it's what makes this place cool, we can all fit in.  But I do think that showing the ranks will start making MORE 10's show, not less.  Because of the "friendship" thing here. I think- maybe- people have been MORE honest when ranking friends- and LESS honest when ranking non friends since ranks became hidden.

Anyhow- I think that glass of stuff I just drank musta been some of Gilly's Babble Juice.  I'm leaving now.

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

I think it's a non-issue.  We should be able to see what we were ranked, no ifs ands or buts.  Reason being....I'm getting sick and tired of putting my sub in the C category, which is supposedly asking for critiques, and getting "Great job, perfect, could not be better." But the rank drops from a 9.9 to a 9.3 or lower (and yes, I'm speaking of one of my subs, doesn't matter which, not the point).

Don't get me wrong....I don't believe that any sub is every truly perfect, but if you're going to rank it as an 8 or a 9, which are both wonderful ranks that anyone should be proud to achieve (and I am honored if someone chooses to rank me that high)....I think the singer deserves to know exactly what it was that brought the rank down....which would in turn allow them to go back and see for themselves and potenitally fix the problem.  There are several people on this site, without naming names, that do this....they praise your sub, don't give any true feedback, and rank lower than everyone else.

The problem is, we're still getting fluffy comments with brutally honest ranks.  That helps no one.  Just my humble opinion.

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Simon: Alright, so we're missing the echo! Robert, I can honestly say you're the worst singer I've ever heard in my life!"

Robert: Thank you!

From X Factor.

If I recall correctly....correct me if I'm wrong....but isn't a 10 considered perfect....I don't know about the rest of you, but I know I'm far from perfect...

Average then would imply that your sub is just as good as but no better than the majority of subs posted.....



I agree....but alas we will beat the poor dead horse one more time...

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[glow=blue]Tequila & A Song
KKid[/glow]

I actually agree, last night i sat here listening to a few songs and doing ma thing, i went to one sub, now i ranked this sub an 8 because of the mix , a few pitch errors and straining, just niggly things which in my opinion would not make this sub a 10 but NOTHING which could not be changed and improved, perhaps a couple of visitors after me thought differently...but had my rank been shown it would be consistant with what i critiqued and i would not be sitting here once again questioning myself on ranking people for fear they will be offended.

I'm with JKolman on this!  I was tickled  :D  when I was rated an 8 on some of my subs.
A 10 is perfect and if we all were deserving of 10's all the time, I really don't think we would be here.  We would be out on tour somewhere.  I have ranked some subs a 10 because I thought they were deserving and have told in my comment a couple of those times that they were getting a 10 from me.  But I guess like everyone else, when I feel the ranking is below a 7 I'm hesitant to comment or rank. So I do neither.  I think anyone should be proud to get anything above the 5 (average).  That is nothing to be upset about.  I know that none of mine are 10's.  I'm probably my worst critic at times.  And the tech stuff drives me crazy!  

Why is everyone so worried about giving average ratings or lower...if a sub deserves a 5 or below so be it....remember an artist can choose not to be ranked...so if they choose to be ranked they should be ready for whatever happens next....pretty simple....like the old song says "Tell It like It Is".....

if I'm a nonmember and I come here and listen to a sub that really sucks, then I read the comments and find things like...."that was great"..."you did a wonderful job"..."etc".....and saw that this sub is ranked a "10"......I would have to assume that the members at this site were tone deaf or some type of mutual admiration society....if it sucks say it sucks.....people deserve to hear the truth....and if one member believes a sub stinks and another believes that it's great....each should rank accordingly.....

                                                   

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[glow=blue]Tequila & A Song
KKid[/glow]

Absolutely yes, Jason. I completely agree. I, for one, am sincerely trying to improve my singing (and feel that I have improved a good bit since I started on here). However, it frustrates me (as well) to see "wow, what a great job this was.." and have a rank of 8 (or less... ). Now don't get me wrong, I'm not complaining about 'low ranking' here, I just want to know WHAT folks here that make them think 'eh, this needs work'.

I may not always agree with what folks have to say, I may not always be happy to hear a criticism I completely didn't expect, but that doesn't mean the criticism is invalid and sometimes I will go back and listen for that particular thing and unhappily realize that they were right. HOWEVER, that gives me something to work on next time I sing and those are the things that have helped me improve.