Karaoke Forums

I am not sure why you do not get it, Digitrax. I have seen people get all up in arms if you just skip them, by accident. I have seen that at my shows and at many other shows. While some may hit you with a quick "Hey, what about me", others will get completely adamant about it. If you start skipping people round a rotation, ESPECIALLY if there is money involved, there will be trouble, at the average show. Now I don't know where your test market has been, but I know my area of the world, and the people around here would not tolerate it. They would not want to hear anything about charities, or anything else. They want their turn in rotation.

While I will not wish doom and gloom upon your company, I really must say I do not like the sound of this new endeavor. I think you should address the problems your own service has, first, before trying something new.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

That argument is a straw man. Running a red light is breaking the law. Bumps are not get-out-of-jail-free cards.

If the DMV had an express lane for a $5 charge, available to everyone willing to pay for the service bump, wouldn't you take it? I know I would. My time is worth a lot more to me than five bucks. In a transparent marketplace available to everyone, this is called doing business. Nothing is done is secret, no one is asking for anything illegal, everyone understands the rules, and the rules apply to everyone equally. Think about it.

What if most of the $5 was donated to rescue stray animals from euthanasia? Would you pay for the service bump then?

Hey Smooth, good to hear from one of the cooler heads around here. As I said above, I feared the worst when I first heard about it too. Turns out I was wrong. People not only adapted almost immediately, they had fun with it in ways I hadn't anticipated. I know karaoQ is not going to be a perfect fit in every possible situation, but I can tell you that the places I visited and saw karaoQ work typically have unusually high percentages of just that kind of diva, convinced they are the next big star and heaven's gift to music.



Tune into the Summit before you make a final decision - we'll have chat open where you can pose questions and comments.

As to the issues we've discussed in PM, I absolutely promise you that we have a handle on delivering a solution very soon. I've taken personal responsibility for it.

Nope, as a customer, I would go to a show that was fair (equal treatment for all, even the ones that struggle to just buy food and drinks, let alone buy their way up in a line)
@ one point I considered offering a similar scheme, but giving any $ to people waiting already, since their time (which should be no less valuable than yours or mine) is what's being infringed upon. But most singers voiced that they wouldn't want to sell their spot in line, since they were there to sing.
I wish you all the luck & success you might gain, but I would not have any part in something that I find morally reprehensible & that would prove to be a degradation of my shows integrity & one sided about whose time is more valuable. This is all supposed to be about fun and fairness. Sorry that we seem to disagree, but I fear it encourages what often times seems to be a growing problem in our society at large.

Nope, as a customer, I would go to a show that was fair (equal treatment for all, even the ones that struggle to just buy food and drinks, let alone buy their way up in a line)
@ one point I considered offering a similar scheme, but giving any $ to people waiting already, since their time (which should be no less valuable than yours or mine) is what's being infringed upon. But most singers voiced that they wouldn't want to sell their spot in line, since they were there to sing.
I wish you all the luck & success you might gain, but I would not have any part in something that I find morally reprehensible & that would prove to be a degradation of my shows integrity & one sided about whose time is more valuable. This is all supposed to be about fun and fairness. Sorry that we seem to disagree, but I fear it encourages what often times seems to be a growing problem in our society at large.

Sorry for the double post... Stoopid Smart Phone! I can't seem to delete the duplicate from here...

That will be good to see, without the UK brands things are going to get tight, where it comes to buying Karaoke downloads. I know that nobody here wants to get named in a suit from Piracy Recovery because of inadequate record keeping on the part of the supplier(Digitrax). So, for that, I and I am sure others will thank you.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

I'll try this one more time - a venue offers you $200 for a night of your services. Another offers you $350. All other things being equal, which offer do you take? If you can take both, which do you prioritize?

This is commerce. There's nothing unfair about it, unless you consider capitalism unethical.



Your time is valuable. You place a price on that time. A heart surgeon might place a higher price on his or hers. This is commerce.



I'm sorry too. You seem a nice enough fellow when you're posting calmly. I wish you luck in your endeavors.

DG

I DO consider some aspects of Capitalism unethical. Receiving money from people just who think they are God's gift to Karaoke, while the guy who isn't paying to move ahead in line sits and waits, to me, IS unethical. Uncontrolled Capitalism, such as we have now, with 85% of the wealth going to 5% of the population is VERY unethical, IMHO. The 85% work their tails of and barely make ends meet, while the upper class just buy and sell the country, in bits and pieces and make obscene fortunes.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

If I truly felt that way, I'd set the price of the bumps to some astronomical amount and make sure my portion went to help poor families buy school supplies for their kids. Siphon off some of that obscene wealth and reapportion it to the disadvantaged. Neat thing about that is, everybody wins.


DG

Gosh, people, get a grip for a second. This isn't the one guy that comes up to you during the show with a $20 in hand asking to be next. This isn't about the fact that you advertise and stick to a no bribe rule.
Bumping a guy up because he has to do an Ethel Merman song would be hilariously fun. This could seriously combat the elitist singers you are fighting to keep at bay.
"Ethical karaoke" isn't running a show where you do not take bribes. "Ethical karaoke" is stating how you run your show then running it that way.

AGAIN, you could take a traditionally slow night and start it there. The singers aren't going to get bumped far on a 10 singer rotation and if promoted properly, could make for a heck of a shake up.

Keep in mind (If I get the gist right) YOU aren't bumping people. The singers are gaining more control of the rotation. And maybe giving up some of that control is the part that has everyone so nervous?

Yes sir, that's the way it works. The KJ still has ultimate control, as always.



You'll be swell. You'll be great. Gonna have the whole world on a plate.



"War is hell." - Ted Striker


DG

One of the bars I worked for in the late 90's wanted me to stack the deck, so that there weren't too many slow songs in a row, because they figured ramping up the customers, would increase sales & provide a "better" environment... It didn't it was discriminatory & unfair, that bar was the reason I started my own show! Customers & patrons shouldn't make any business, or it's representatives see dollar signs. This is a potential friend, for whom you don't give special privilege, as you have a lot of friends all created equal. The friendship, the fairness, the not being about just money will build a deep patronage & friendship beyond comparison. The two best compliments ever given me were 1) at a bar I was doing every other weekend, a patron's family member who visited from Alaska, coordinated their trips down, based on the schedule, so they could make it to the show. 2) A graduating University student cried, hugged me & explained that I was the most real, important person & the best experience of his whole University experience!! Fairness, & sadly a less capitalistic approach bears it's own payment WAY more valuable than any amount of money.
Karaoke can be a form of therapy that speaks to & from our very souls. Capitalizing on friends, clients, patrons (however you view them) cheapens the whole thing. In my opinion.
& yes capitalism has grown out of control, this nation was never supposed to be an oligarchy, & will be shifting for the people soon, or there may be a class war such that even France has never seen (put your guillotines away... Hide them well & quick!). So should we work for the betterment of the people, not our pockets!

It's not about just people with money or high ratings. That loyal patron you just mentioned can get bump credits by doing just that - being loyal. Their act of returning to the venue multiple times will earn them credits to use as they see fit, so again we would challenge that if we are incentivizing those who are loyal patrons, great performers, enact on a special promotion like a drink order, win a dare challenge versus a friend, or simply pay to skip - and all this is done fairly, openly, and transparently, there is simply no uneven playing field.

Go to our Facebook page. Watch the videos from Oktoberfest that we just did. 500-700 people at our karakQ/Karaoke Cloud stage. 2 blocks deep. We made $400 that day I'm Bumps. Does it look like everyone is fighting or pissed in those videos? Not at all. Quite the opposite. Transparency. And if you are afraid of transparency and patrons being able to see the queue and alter it on-demand through any means, then that is the root of someone's distain and I would question why be worried?

I too have been involved with "forums" since before the Internet. I ran several BBSes in the 80's including one of the larger social chat BBSes in the country. I understand the dynamics of online forums.

I agree with you about that current state of this forum. I have been on this forum for 5 years now and it not the same now as it was when I joined. I believe that can be tracked to a single individual that insists on making every conversation a SC witch hunt.

I understand why you wouldn't want to participate. I hope you understand that popping in to promote a summit (which is actually going to just be a marketing seminar) will be received with skepticism and pushback. Especially considering that Digitrax is the sponsor and its real or perceived connection to Chartbuster.

I love technology. I have my own plans for software, apps, and services for the karaoke world. I am not fearful in the slightest either. I even want to be wrong about KaraoQ. However, the experience so far hasn't been easy nor has there been anything revealed on the KaraoQ site or in what I have been able to see in the app that convinces me I can boost my revenues at all without the Tip/bump feature.

And on that point, as a marketing person myself, I know you want "bump" to be the word instead of "bribe", but it is a bribe (to persuade (someone) to act in one's favor, by a gift of money or other inducement) and it goes against the way MOST karaoke in the US is managed. This will be their uphill battle with adoption.

The fear people have is that a new generation of singers and KJ's who don't care about "fairness" will simply take the money instead of treating their customers fairly and respectfully. Myself and many others have built a reputation on this fairness and respect. A program that is diametrically opposed to what we have built our reputations on will of course be met with opposition.

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-Chris

So.... what's the difference in YOUR definition? ONLY that one transaction is "clandestine" and that's really all. Your "bump" is nothing more than a "transparent bribe" in order to achieve that same result: "secure an unfair advantage."

But because it's money to you, it's much more palatable to label it "commerce" instead.

Why should we trust you? Seriously, give us some reasons here because;
(1) we've seen you deny completely that your firm had anything to do with Chartbuster, yet you didn't have a problem collecting any balances on Chartbuster hard drive sales,
(2) we've seen 25% of your entire streaming library vaporize overnight
(3) one of the largest complaints is that your firm doesn't even give customers a receipt for their purchases. (why is it that it appears you don't want a paper trail?)

I, for one, don't give a squat about your fearless leader's curriculum vitae, he's primarily in the software business.

BTW, if a KJ simply posts a price list for singers to get moved up in the list -- and offers a "Frequent Singer Card" then there is no difference... it's still a "transparent commerce transaction that is equally available to all", except you won't make a dime and it all goes to the KJ and venue.

I like that idea even better.

Well ok, if people with NO money had a way to earn credits, i could see how that MIGhT work, but i STILL think there is an inherant unequalness to the whole thing..

Think about it, a person who does have the money can earn those same credits by simply coming every week AND they still have enough money to bump without using those credits that you speak of. So in reality, that gives them even MORE of an advantage cause they can still buy their way to the top faster than a loyal patron with just enough money to buy the ocassional snack and a drink.

Oktoberfest is a poor example, because it's not a regular, weekly thing. Show me some actual data from a WEEKLY show, and then i'll start listening

I have no stake in this, as I currently do not have any gigs I am just going on my personal experience.

As a host you try to avoid it as much as you can, but in my experience people who frequent a weekly karaoke show on a regular basis *practically every week* are the cheapest, most self-entitled people that you will ever meet as soon as you put a microphone in their hand.

in every day life, these people are normal, very reasonable people. But when it comes to their karaoke experience, it's all "me, me, me screw everyone else"

If you can show me a way that EVERYONE can be treated fairly WITHOUT money becoming invloved AT ALL*not even one single solitary cent*, i'm all ears.

For the record, despite all my objections, i will be listening to your seminar/webinar aka marketing pitch

Like I said, there are SOME shows that would work with that program, Oktoberfest definitely fits the bill. AS well as any carnival or fair gig someone might come up against.

I am sure that under the right circumstances, this hosting software would be very successful.

Just not weekly shows.

And reading back, you take 25% of the bump money? Wow, that's a little steep don't you think?

For those that are interested, i just looked up the defination of bribe from webster's dictionary.

"Full Definition of BRIBE

1
: money or favor given or promised in order to influence the judgment or conduct of a person in a position of trust
2
: something that serves to induce or influence
See bribe defined for English-language learners
See bribe defined for kids

Examples of BRIBE

I offered the children a bribe for finishing their homework.
<that judge refused a huge bribe to dismiss the charges against the wealthy defendant"

Notice there is no use of the word 'clandestine'

That is a one time event which I could totally see it working in. Show us regular weekly event with average joe's coming in to sing and not want to watch a bunch of people buy their way ahead of them while they sit and wait for their turn and be happy about it.

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