Karaoke Forums

So, I'm well aware that this has probably been covered to death, but you've all been quite helpful to me in the past, and I'd like to pick your brains some more.

My current favorite weekly gig has been going strong for about a year and a half. I'm quite proud of it; it's evolved into something of a phenomenon (complete with commemorative t-shirts depicting cartoon versions of favorite performers selling out nightly), a local event that's garnered entertainment press coverage, and the bar's highest sales night of the week, even beating out sets from hotly buzzed-about local bands. This show is a source of pride for me, and easily the best thing I've accomplished as a karaoke host. I love it.

However, I've noticed that unwieldy rotations are a consequence of this. Not a bad problem to have, but I want to figure out how to make it regular-friendly without alienating new folks. So far, I've been setting a rotation and filtering late arrivals into that original rotation by alternating them with early arrivals. It's the best way I've been able to figure out how to do it, but does anyone more accustomed to large rotations have a better trick to handling it? I'd appreciate any advice!

Unfortunately too many singers can be as big a problem as too few. There is no sure fire way to please everyone sort of a Ricky Nelson moment, like in the song "Garden Party". The answer is the same you can't please everyone so you have to please yourself. You have to find a way that is comfortable with you and stick to it. In any rotation system devised discipline and consistency is a must. Nothing will shoot a successful show down faster than the singers thinking you are giving others special treatment. Sometimes they think that even though it may not be true. Good Luck.

P.S. One way you might be able to help the situation is to make karaoke available, by increasing your number of gigs per week. If your show is that successful the venue might want to increase the number of nights you play, also other venues might be interested in your services.

Andrew3000 - I do something similar to what you do. So do other KJ's. On the other hand, you will have a few other KJ's, not to mention singers that will think you are the devil incarnate for mixing new and repeat.

Ignore all of us and simply do what works best for your gigs and remain consistent. You really can't go wrong if you pick a method and stick with it.

-Chris

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-Chris

The above 2 reply's are both spot on! Read them again and then again.
Focus on the word consistent.

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Music speaks to the heart in ways words cannot express.

All very true! I do have multiple weekly gigs, but not at this venue; it's a venue that lends itself well to spectacle (elevated stage, lights, fog, etc), so I think people who want to tap their inner rock star take well to it. Which isn't to say that my other shows are bad, just that they pale in comparison to this one. Unfortunately, the owner is pretty set on a single karaoke night a week; I think he wants to keep it an "event" instead of splitting the difference between multiple nights, which I get.

I definitely understand that any whiff of preferential treatment will be the death of me, which is why I'm very strict with my rotation. I've lost many a singer with "American Idol" aspirations (and many a "friend" who thought that an "in" with the host would grant them rotation carte blanche) to my insistence that everyone gets a fair shot. Thanks for your insight - it's quite helpful!

Strict rotation is good, Andrew. Agree with Lone’s, Chris’ & RLC’s posts. Adhere to a consistent standard rules that your singers can get accustomed to & stick with it. There are many keys to become successful in this business, but I think one of the most significant is consistency!

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To be fortunate enough to derive an income from a source as fulfilling as karaoke music has got to be as close to heaven as we can get here on earth!

Echo consistancy! Whether you stick all new at the end or insert them within the old (which is how i've done it for 20 years), do not change format from one night to another. People learn what to expect at a show rotation wise and those that don't like it are usually in the minority for those that are your regulars - and often cannot make them happy anyway you run it.

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Having a big rotation on a few of my night I do it like this:

Beginning of the night... first come first serve. New singers go to the bottom... UNTIL

we get to about 10 singers. I take myself out and start filtering the new ones in 3 old, 3 new. Its important to make sure you keep couples together.

Also... very important... no singer can appear in the rotation more than more than
TWICE... once for their own song, and once for a duet.

No song can be sung more than once a night.

Don't be a 'Rotation Nazi'. That is.. your strict adherence to the rotation rules gets in the way of fun. For example... you have 8 singers and you have someone who ends up slipping in a third time. Let them know about the rule, and that you will be a bit more strict when it 'gets busy."

Or

A song gets sung at the beginning of the night, and a new person wants to sing it near the end of the night.

Don't move anyone up no matter how pretty they are... but if they slip you a $50 go for it (just kidding )

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

I would suggest that before changing or tweaking things in your most successful show, perhaps you should first find ways to replicate that success to your other shows by identifying the differences. Consistency is the key, and if you have a consistently good show...

However, if you are determined to rock the boat, within these threads are the instructions to achieving the perfect rotation:
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28450
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=27868
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=23250
viewtopic.php?f=1&t=15840

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KNOW THYSELF

I had a guy walk up to me just as I was putting my laptop in my bag ask if I would let him sing 1 more song, for $50, for his girlfriend. I let him sing three Everyone else had left the building.

That's hilarious. Once I had this guy coming up, wanting to sing next... and really bugging me. Finally, he comes up to me and puts a $50 in my hand and say, "That's so I'm next."

Now, I look at the rotation and the guy was actually next! So, not missing a beat, I'm like, "Alright buddy, you got it, you're next!" and quietly pocketed the $50.

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Good music, good friends, howling good times!

I can not tell you how important being consistent is. I, too, struggled with the best way to handle my rotation. I found myself experimenting with different ways every few days and THAT was actually what was causing the complaints. At one point, I was getting so many complaints and losing people that I almost wanted to just quit.

But then earlier this summer, I made a decision to put all newcomers at the end of a floating rotation list and stick to that no matter what. Best freagin' decision I ever made. I've been doing it this way for over 6 months now and everybody knows how it works and I don't get any complaints anymore. I can't remember the last time I had a rotation complaint.

So it's true. Like others have said. The answer to how you do your rotation lies within you. YOU have to pick a way and just stick to it. No way will please everyone, but being consistent will gain you respect and keep your regulars happy as possible.

And since we are talking rotation, let me tell you how my method works.

On the first rotation, everyone goes to the bottom of the list. As soon as we reach the second rotation, I start putting new people right in front of the person who is currently singing. That will show the current singer at the beginning of the list and the new person at the end of the list. On my display, I show all the singers' names on the board. That way, when I add a new person, it appears on the board as if that person went directly to the end of the list.

When people become confused, I always point to my board and say, "See? I just added the new person to the very end of the list." Once they see that, they are happy.

What I used to do was only display 3 or 4 singers at a time. That caused a lot of mistrust. By doing it that way, the audience can not see where I am adding new people. So if I have a long list and I add some new people, but the audience doesn't see their names on the board, after an hour goes by and then all of a sudden they see some new people's name appear, in their minds, they think I have just now added them, not realizing the new people have been waiting an hour. That got me in trouble so many times in the past.

But now that I show the complete rotation list on the board at all times, all problems have gone away.

Hope that helps. Not saying that way is correct for everyone, just saying that way is correct for me and I will never change it.

Good luck!

Sounds like an identical story I had a few years back, except the guy was bugging me to get his girlfriend up for $50. Kept asking every song knowing she was only a few songs down to begin with. Finally insisted I get her up next and threw the 50 at me, I said fine, she's next and kept the money - she was next anyway, if he wouldv'e waited another 5 seconds for me to call her name it would have saved him 50 bucks!

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Love the stories about bribes. I see nothing wrong with you guys taking their money if they/their friend/their partner is actually next anyway. It's kind of like you got away with fining them for being a d(^$%^&e

Just one more thought the consistency aspect of the rotation goes to the issue of the integrity of the host running the show. The reason I believe I was so successful was not because I was the best singing karaoke host, believe me I wasn't, or the flashy type. The reason most singers came back to my show and it grew was because I was looked at, as the fairest host and didn't play favorites. One time a venue owner told me to put his friends in ahead of other singers that had been there all night. I told him that would not be right to the customers that had been there all night buying food and drinks. He told me later that he had been drinking and after thinking things over I was right, and he respected me the more. I guess it helps when the show is supplemental and not the main source of income for a host. Many are pressured by the money aspect of things, after all most have to be practical, not artistic.

Similar situation, not the main source of income for a host. The club manager (newly hired) wants his brother to sing next, I told him it’s a 30 min wait. He said “well, guess who’s paying you to work here. If you don’t let him sing next, don’t bother to come back next week”. So I told him “I can wrap it up right now, quit & go home. I don’t tell you how to run your club, please don’t tell me how to run my show”. He realized I was serious, his brother sang 30 min later. He apologized, held me in a little higher esteem for sticking with my rules. Applied Consistency!

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To be fortunate enough to derive an income from a source as fulfilling as karaoke music has got to be as close to heaven as we can get here on earth!

Well right now, my karaoke business IS my main source of income. I don't have a day job. Karaoke is it for me. However, I still don't allow people to tell me how to run my show.

Last week at my Monday night Applebee's show, the manager on duty told me her daughter's fiance was in the restaurant and that he was the lead singer in some band I had never heard of. She said they were about to leave so I needed to let him sing next.

I told her there were 7 people in front of him at the time and asked her if she still wanted me to put him on the list. She said, "Can't you just let him sing now so he and my daughter can leave?" I told her no. I don't do that. He has to wait in line like everyone else. So she said to go ahead and put him on the list.

When it was his turn, he sang his song. After he sung, he did not leave and also stuck around to sing in the next rotation too. Later that night at closing, the manager apologized to me for trying to make me put him first. She said, "I don't know why he said he had to leave right away and then stuck around for over an hour."

Yeah, she didn't know why... but I did.

If I had a dime for every time I hear a singer say………..“Let me sing next, I have to (fill the blanks)”. You tell them No, so they wait, sang the song, & then sing again the next rotation thereafter.

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To be fortunate enough to derive an income from a source as fulfilling as karaoke music has got to be as close to heaven as we can get here on earth!

I love owners and managers like that. Other than the no swearing rule they have (that is for the bar in general, not just the karaoke although we enforce it more), they have never interfered nor tried to get someone up because they were paying me.

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