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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 2:45 pm 
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leopard lizard wrote:
Yes it does--the question is shouldn't the person creating the art or the product or providing the service be the one to decide whether they want to share their art/product/service for free or is it okay that others decide to share it for them without permission?

Only the bands themselves should make that decision, where it comes to sharing their music. The record companies should have no say. It's like Spotify, some bands don't want their music streamed on that service. Most are fine with it. Most of the bands were fine with the sharing. It was the RIAA that had the problem with it. In the end they came out of it looking like crap. Now, little but little the bands are forming their own labels to be free of the RIAA.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:06 pm 
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The music belongs to the copyright holder. And who do you think fronts the money for the tours? The labels who invested the money producing and marketing the artists and their music. The labels risk the money, not the artist (unless they are self-produced).

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:08 pm 
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timberlea wrote:
The music belongs to the copyright holder. And who do you think fronts the money for the tours? The labels who invested the money producing and marketing the artists and their music. The labels risk the money, not the artist (unless they are self-produced).

Why do you think so many bands are starting their own labels?? They want to be in charge of their own music. They want to have the say in what goes on, not some corporate entity.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:28 pm 
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And if they start to protect their music by suing people who illegally copy their music then you're okay with it? Sort of in the same vein as producers do, including karaoke labels? Or is itonly karaoke labels who shouldn't be allowed to protect their product from being copied?

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:39 pm 
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timberlea wrote:
And if they start to protect their music by suing people who illegally copy their music then you're okay with it? Sort of in the same vein as producers do, including karaoke labels? Or is itonly karaoke labels who shouldn't be allowed to protect their product from being copied?

If they all start doing it, I will just have to carry my discs around. It will be a pain in the (@$%&#!), but I will survive. Until that day, which I do not think will come, I will go for the convenience of being computer based, OR drop discs altogether and BUY downloads, like I have been doing.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 3:51 pm 
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Smoothedge69 wrote:
Well the closing of those file sharing site hurt many of the smaller, less popular bands. They fought against those closures. For many bands, file sharing was their best outlet to get their music to the people. !

There are plenty of legit sites that bands can promote without being a P2P files sharing.
One is Soundclick.com (just one of many like this). All original bands/musicians. Streaming and download capability for the listener - bands can dictate whether the downloads are free, pay per download, license usage, etc. They don't need file sharing sites to get their music heard.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 4:35 pm 
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Lonman wrote:
Smoothedge69 wrote:
Well the closing of those file sharing site hurt many of the smaller, less popular bands. They fought against those closures. For many bands, file sharing was their best outlet to get their music to the people. !

There are plenty of legit sites that bands can promote without being a P2P files sharing.
One is Soundclick.com (just one of many like this). All original bands/musicians. Streaming and download capability for the listener - bands can dictate whether the downloads are free, pay per download, license usage, etc. They don't need file sharing sites to get their music heard.

NOW they have stuff like that. Back then not so much.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 5:57 pm 
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Well our band has been on Soundclick since 2000, absolutely nothing new. How far back are you talking - P2P was just starting to rear it's ugly head around that time, so can't be much further back? There were several other sites we promoted through that were similar (but not P2P - same setup as Soundclick), can't remember them right off hand since I am no longer playing I only keep up on the one site anymore.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:00 pm 
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Lonman wrote:
Well our band has been on Soundclick since 2000, absolutely nothing new. How far back are you talking - P2P was just starting to rear it's ugly head around that time, so can't be much further back? There were several other sites we promoted through that were similar (but not P2P - same setup as Soundclick), can't remember them right off hand since I am no longer playing I only keep up on the one site anymore.

I started using winMX back in 2001, when I got my first computer. Never heard of Soundclick.

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PostPosted: Tue Dec 11, 2012 6:06 pm 
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http://www.soundclick.com/default.cfm
They've actually been around since 97 I just saw.
Doesn't matter, point was, bands don't need the peer to peer sites to get their material out.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:00 am 
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Alex wrote:
Just because some of you chose to close their eyes to facts, doesn't mean the facts go away. Piracy is piracy and will hurt honest people no matter where or what the subject is.

You can close your eyes as long as you want... I applaud the efforts to fight piracy that are taking place more and more. Will the problem go away over night? No, but they will crack down sooner or later, even in front of your door...

And from some statements I gathered here and on other sites around. No one is hitting the breaks when it comes to prosecute pirates. Next year they will hit the gas pedal even more.


That is the party line given out by James that next year a major offensive against piracy will be launched, and woe to the evil doers. I have heard this same tune for quite awhile. One thing is for sure there is no flip side to that record. I'm not closing my eyes, just saying there has to be a better way to deal with the problem. The present process is failing miserably or why even do Cloud, why not pour all the remaining manu resources into the legal dog and pony show? Have a nice day.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 1:47 pm 
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SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 12, 2012 1:55 pm 
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Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.


They were close though during the Las Vegas convention, so it was said. They probably didn't sign on because the money wasn't enough, who knows. What is their business model? The legal process used to promote sales of their product? They were supposed resume production of new material sometime this year, that didn't happen either. They like to act like things are going to get cracking, all I see is no new product, small dollar settlements in Florida, and dismissed cases in spades. Well maybe Santa will bring them a big juicy case to file. Have a nice day.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:29 am 
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The Lone Ranger wrote:
Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.


They were close though during the Las Vegas convention, so it was said. They probably didn't sign on because the money wasn't enough, who knows. What is their business model? The legal process used to promote sales of their product? They were supposed resume production of new material sometime this year, that didn't happen either. They like to act like things are going to get cracking, all I see is no new product, small dollar settlements in Florida, and dismissed cases in spades. Well maybe Santa will bring them a big juicy case to file. Have a nice day.


I think that the reason SC will not join the Cloud or ever offer D/L's is that if they ever do then they will have a hard time distinguishing those that have ripped from discs from those that have D/L'ed their stuff, unless of course they somehow imprint within the graphics part a registration number that would show up continuously on the screen so that their top notch :wink: investigators don't miss it.

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:39 am 
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Lone Wolf wrote:
The Lone Ranger wrote:
Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.


They were close though during the Las Vegas convention, so it was said. They probably didn't sign on because the money wasn't enough, who knows. What is their business model? The legal process used to promote sales of their product? They were supposed resume production of new material sometime this year, that didn't happen either. They like to act like things are going to get cracking, all I see is no new product, small dollar settlements in Florida, and dismissed cases in spades. Well maybe Santa will bring them a big juicy case to file. Have a nice day.


I think that the reason SC will not join the Cloud or ever offer D/L's is that if they ever do then they will have a hard time distinguishing those that have ripped from discs from those that have D/L'ed their stuff, unless of course they somehow imprint within the graphics part a registration number that would show up continuously on the screen so that their top notch :wink: investigators don't miss it.


This is true Lone Wolf, if they ever do either of these, it will signal in my opinion they have given up, and thrown in the towel. Where will there loyal supporters be if they do? Have a nice day.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:29 pm 
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The Lone Ranger wrote:
Lone Wolf wrote:
The Lone Ranger wrote:
Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.


They were close though during the Las Vegas convention, so it was said. They probably didn't sign on because the money wasn't enough, who knows. What is their business model? The legal process used to promote sales of their product? They were supposed resume production of new material sometime this year, that didn't happen either. They like to act like things are going to get cracking, all I see is no new product, small dollar settlements in Florida, and dismissed cases in spades. Well maybe Santa will bring them a big juicy case to file. Have a nice day.


I think that the reason SC will not join the Cloud or ever offer D/L's is that if they ever do then they will have a hard time distinguishing those that have ripped from discs from those that have D/L'ed their stuff, unless of course they somehow imprint within the graphics part a registration number that would show up continuously on the screen so that their top notch :wink: investigators don't miss it.


This is true Lone Wolf, if they ever do either of these, it will signal in my opinion they have given up, and thrown in the towel. Where will there loyal supporters be if they do? Have a nice day.


Or.....they could do just what they did with the GEM series which is change or update the graphics/scrolls and have a unique "trade dress" for downloadable content.

*AND/OR*

Digitally watermark the downloadable files.

The former would be a simple visual indication of where the content came from and they could easily still continue to maintain their current lawsuit policy while adding yet another course of action to do a different kind of investigation on downloaded versions.

-Chris

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PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:40 pm 
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chrisavis wrote:
Or.....they could do just what they did with the GEM series which is change or update the graphics/scrolls and have a unique "trade dress" for downloadable content.

*AND/OR*

Digitally watermark the downloadable files.

The former would be a simple visual indication of where the content came from and they could easily still continue to maintain their current lawsuit policy while adding yet another course of action to do a different kind of investigation on downloaded versions.

-Chris

both are good options, the serial watermark on the KJMP tracks was i think the best idea.

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 8:06 am 
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chrisavis wrote:
The Lone Ranger wrote:
Lone Wolf wrote:
The Lone Ranger wrote:
Paradigm Karaoke wrote:
SC has not joined the cloud, they haven't given up on this business model yet.


They were close though during the Las Vegas convention, so it was said. They probably didn't sign on because the money wasn't enough, who knows. What is their business model? The legal process used to promote sales of their product? They were supposed resume production of new material sometime this year, that didn't happen either. They like to act like things are going to get cracking, all I see is no new product, small dollar settlements in Florida, and dismissed cases in spades. Well maybe Santa will bring them a big juicy case to file. Have a nice day.


I think that the reason SC will not join the Cloud or ever offer D/L's is that if they ever do then they will have a hard time distinguishing those that have ripped from discs from those that have D/L'ed their stuff, unless of course they somehow imprint within the graphics part a registration number that would show up continuously on the screen so that their top notch :wink: investigators don't miss it.


This is true Lone Wolf, if they ever do either of these, it will signal in my opinion they have given up, and thrown in the towel. Where will there loyal supporters be if they do? Have a nice day.


Or.....they could do just what they did with the GEM series which is change or update the graphics/scrolls and have a unique "trade dress" for downloadable content.

*AND/OR*

Digitally watermark the downloadable files.

The former would be a simple visual indication of where the content came from and they could easily still continue to maintain their current lawsuit policy while adding yet another course of action to do a different kind of investigation on downloaded versions.

-Chris


Yes they could do both but unless something shows up on the screen while being played how would an investigator know if it an original d/l or a copied d/l. I'm beginning to wonder just how DT does it. If anybody has d/l tracks from DT other than the logo screen how can you recognize it is an original d/l from a copy?

If you think about it this is going to become a problem as same as before. After all if you think about it someone originally bought the SC, CB, etc discs ripped them and posted them to a P2P site, so what is going to keep someone from doing the same with the DT tracks?

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PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:53 pm 
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the only difference is the DT logo. there are no other markings like serial numbers or anything.

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