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The bands I liked were pretty much known as "Arena Rock", and such bands included as I mentioned Boston, Journey, and Foreigner.. Vocals had a pretty similar quality to them but not sure they were as high as they seemed ALTHOUGH in this rendition Thomas IS higher than I heard while listening to a rendition a few weeks back. Here's an example.  In BOTH the recording Thomas does, and this Cover band version (I think) the vocals come in on the same B note.  IOW.. Both singers in both versions are performing the song in the SAME key (as opposed to octave apart registers) although voice timbre appears higher when Thomas sings this.. but IS thomas an octave higher ?  Or is something about his technique and timbre used making him appear to have the higher voice, when in reality he's singing more softly and using a different technique yet this is STILL his real voice but not technically head-voice. I can't believe these two renditions aren't the same vocal register.

Michael Thomas singing "Jane"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j5D96zobJJw

Cover rendition ???  (but same key, same B starting note) different style ??
http://www.broadcaster.com/clip/4003


Are these arena rock vocalists such as Brad Delp, and Mick Thomas 1st tenor or 2nd tenor range vocalists with a certain type timbre that makes them appear higher in range ?

Is this sort've a throat voice rock scream technique, or a first tenor range male vocalist ? in the above.. The timing of the taping and sound are totally off here..
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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Sheesh,  I HOPE those two vocalists aren't singing an octave apart, that'd be embarassing if I didn't detect that.. The two renditions above of "Jane" I hope are both in the same key sung differently in the same register.  Is the first version being sung an octave higher than the second version ?  Or is the vocal timbre such that Thomas gets his voice to appear higher ? (I think??)  These can't be an octave apart this has got to be how vocal timbre in rock and style fools the listeners ear, or fooled what I thought was an ear..  Thomas sounds higher than he's truly singing.. He's got to be.. Or I'm a horses patooty ? This is difference in timbre, style and not pitch, right ?


AC/DC is a perfect example of rock screaming and pure gravel yell with raunch added...  Bon Scott was an example of arguably a non-singer who introduced pure dirtiness of vocal quality and roaring into the rock arena..IMHO..  I acquired a taste for them. and now they are among my favorites.. But I don't know how many vocalists would consider Bon Scotts vocal quality an actual gift...

As much as I like Bon Scott,  you can put a pitch shifter/corrector in from of a pet cat, step on it's tail, and you've got a lead singer for AC/DC

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Dup post edited.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Can somebody please just listen to the beginnings of the two versions posted a few posts back of Starship's Jane,  and explain how these two vocalists are utilizing different timbre ?  They are both singing in the same key, and B is where they come in on the first song not "Jane" however is this the same register but timbre and style making the difference ? Why Thomas is sounding higher ????

I'm not sure... HELP !   Is Mick Thomas an octave higher ?  I think not.  IS this how rock singers use throat voice styles to get a certain timbre ? Yet not headvoice ? and they aren't even actually wailing but just sound it ?

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

bwahahahah

But DYLAN makes it WORK!!!

Yep you're right Seby. Bob Dylan does make it work.  His lyrics, expression, and persona over rides any pitch problems.  I didn't get to see him in concert until the late '80s when he had GE Smith and the Saturday Night Live band backing him. That was a great concert.  He covered all of his song eras from strictly acoustic to electric and he sang with spirit and energy.  Then I saw him solo in '93 opening for Santana.  That concert was a different story!  I don't know what went wrong there.  It was like he was doing a bad, comical impersonation of himself -- singing with an extreme pinched nose, whiny head voice.  Bob's voice definitely changes from year to year.

I always liked these two songs.

One Too Many Mornings
http://download.yousendit.com/538551F0153CF017

One Of Us Must Know
http://download.yousendit.com/1172AD0175DF2D0C

I agree... Dylan's voice did vary a lot over time. I think he sometimes just got kind of lazy singing. It's not like he was a 'great' singer on his best days, but he epitomized the 'folk' category I guess (for the most part).

I couldn't listen to the songs you linked to. Links were not working for me for some reason.

CONFUSED!!!!!  Bob Dylan is mentioned under  a thread titled good singers?  
personally i really don;t think he can sing at all,  i never knew words could be drown out so far....wellllllll  come to think of it jack nicholson  does that alot to....and i don't think he can sing either but atleast he can act....JMO

 LMAO

Hey, I like Jack Nicholson too

You either like Dylan or you don't.  There's not a whole lot in between!  LOL

I agree with you 100% here.  I will give Bob Dylan credit as an excellent poet, a talented story-teller and he's composed some fine songs.  He's made a name for himself as a lyricist, and song writer. If you rebelled and had an interesting story, you could call it whatever you wanted to.. Because it was cool to be different and clash.. So Dylan, Donovan, and others who were decent songwriters that insisted on doing THEIR OWN thing was able to pass.. Rebelling was cool..  Dylan insisted that during a rebelious period, he can rebel against tonal styles of music and change the trend to atonal (drugged out mumbling) and howl somewhere around the pitch and it MIGHT resemble music,  it'll be called HIS music..

Yet there was nothing pleasing to ME ear (at least) about Dylans signature style, and that of MANY others during that period... While what he did ended up falling into a singing category,  I'd have contracted ALL my material to Roger McGuinn, and others.. and let them grace my lyrics with the quality of tonality they deserve..

But the times, they were a changing.  What Dylan was, was a spectacular story teller, and he used the music realm to communicate great poetry..  Similarly I found Neil Young EXCEPTIONALLY depressing and annoying to listen to without Crosby, Stills and Nash singing along..  His lyrics, and mood just really turned me off.. I can't stand that falsetto of his, etc etc etc

JMHO.. but we seemed to accept "all goes" as innovative during a time when singers such as

Jagger
Cocker
Rod Stewart
Bono
Dylan (Tom Petty who styled himself after Dylan)
That gawd awful Canned Heat vocalist
Bon Scott
Robert Plant
Bowies choice for a signature style
Neil Young

How many of these folks could sing ?  Or did we just learn to accept them and acquire a taste for what they were doing ?  Not all did but we were young and impressionable.. These were by no stretch of the imagination polished gifted "singers".. They did Carve their voices into history however so they were innovators

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

ok u went to far when u said rod stewert, gotta love his voice...and style...jmo....

I only appreciate Dylan's music sometimes.. and depends on how he was singing at the moment. I think that the fact he did NOT sing 'perfectly' was actually part of his appeal at the time. He was a very 'real' sounding singer, and of course a great lyricist. I think he appealed to people partly because his voice wasn't intimidating, making his music feel approachable and very singable.

I LOVE Bowie's voice... on just about anything... and I know you were saying that the Beatles' voices, individually, weren't that great.. but I think Lennon was actually a very good singer independently (not so much the others). Heck, I've even heard a live recording of Simon & Garfunkel that was cringe-worthy.

A vocalist who strives for technical perfection, might not even enjoy a jazz singer or a blues singer. I DO know that even singers who people like, such as Dylan, HAVE to remain within certain pitch constraints or even THEY sound horrible.

I think a song such as "Lay Lady Lay" suits Dylan.  Dylan CAN actually sing on pitch. He just seemed to opt not to when establishing his own signature style, and to me MOST of Dylan SOUNDS HORRIBLE.  Yet I really enjoy the stories he tells, so I read his lyrics, I won't listen to his albums. His whiney voice gets on my nerves !  Bowie has an amazing voice when he wishes to sing without his raunch "pop" style.. I can't stand his pop voice, hence, won't listen to him either.. Similarly many do.. Cheryl Crowe opts to sing with a different style but she's VERY capable of singing "stunt" voicing as she did while backing up Michael Jackson.. I personal never liked Lennons singing however I think McCartney came the closest.. But McCartney is also a gifted multiinstrumentalist that comes from a musical family. Still, not a natural singer IMHO..

When I think about it, relative to many genres of music, Rock has quite a concentration of people that aren't really great singers that carved their vocal style into the genre.. BLUES took getting used to gravel.  If I could be a clone musician, I'd wish to be Gary Moore.  To me the guy can sing and play guitar..  There aren't too many others I'd wish to emulate.  I strive for arena rock excellence, not perfection   ... I really aspire to be Bostons replacement vocalist before the year is over.. I want to sing exactly like Brad Delp by november !   Won't settle for less

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

( I really aspire to be Bostons replacement vocalist before the year is over.. I want to sing exactly like Brad Delp by november !   Won't settle for less)

is that johnny depp?

Look like Johnny Depp... Sing like Brad Delp.

It's really amazing yet also horrible how things turn out sometimes..  One would've thought a man like Brad Delp had it all... Rock Icon, signature pop music top of the line vocalist, He was my singing "roll model" in classic rock, NEVER would've thought he'd be lonely... Just goes to show.. Things are never as they appear looking in without ANY awareness of who and what the person is..

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".