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Billy,

This is how I did it,  and it becomes clearer after time.  The first decision in order for anybody to quit, is they REALLY must know that they HAVE to stop. Not just intellectually, but REALLY emotionally know what's happened too.  While ciggies did something for a time and might've felt "good",  I found myself one day with a bad "illness" and at that point viewed cigarettes as "the germ" that I got too close to, and now must stay FAR away from, or innoculate myself from the germ KNOWING, *Life has changed and these can't exist in MY life anylonger* It's a decision as you say to give it 100%.  Going "all out" can allow us to party crazy, and also straighten up.  It can be an advantage once we realize our mind has the strength to enable us to do positive stuff and do it well !

I never gave ciggies some "magic control" over my life.  I never projected my issue and problem was "THEM".. I owned up to the fact that I overindulged !! and knowing how I am,  they need to disappear from MY life now.

"They" were never "doing this to me", (because they aren't very smart, they don't have "IQ's", they aren't even living things). How could *THEY* be "doing this to me" ?  The problem is that being human and having certain strengths and limitations *I* fell into an EXTERNAL means of trying to fulfill something that MUST be fulfilled internally and in time *My* chemistry changed, and I now was left sick and had to either stay away from these "germs" (ciggies), or innoculate myself (which fortuneately I was strong enough to do with cigarettes even at the onset once I *REALLY* decided *I'm going to quit, because I have *NO choice*.  I opted to breath, and live !  Intellectually and emotional it was obvious based on what they did to me the first time I had one (sick as all hell) that this was a strong irritant, and I'm not made of brick like a chimney.

The decision was made the final time I quit that I now must "JUST SAY NO" to these external things that I was using for what I hoped to be beneficial reason but in reality this stuff is/was poison to me and killing me.

Once I *knew* that this was real, not a game, nothing negotiable, I QUIT !

I never DAMNED THEM.  I acknowledged that at a certain period in my life, they served as a means to make me feel a certain way.  Now things have changed, and I'm realizing the games over.  These are weapons for self-destruction

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Regarding Golf and Pool.


Those became fiasco's in my hands too !     I had to give those up too ! Very dangerous !

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Here I am with you. I just don't think that legitimizing slipping as OK helps anyone. It is like, "go ahead and slip, you are still OK". I like to tell people, "if you survive the experience, you can come back". Because I have sadly seen many an alcoholic slip, fall, and *not* survive.

If you do slip, learn from it to be sure. But don't carry in the back of your mind "if I do, it will be OK". Because it may well not be OK -- this stuff kills people. I have two sisters, a father in law, an aunt, an uncle, and many friends stone cold dead because of alcoholism.

That being said, I know you can't scare a smoker smoke free nor an alcoholic sober. They have to scare themselves, and if you give them the info they may finally wake up and realize they don't want to die.


My experience differs on that. People who make a business of quitting never seem to.


Here I agree with you 100%. There are no guarantees -- I haven't guaranteed anyone I am not going to smoke or drink again. I haven't promised my mother, my wife, my daughters, or myself. If I do, then when I say "one day at a time" there is an automatic "for the rest of my life" added on to the end.

(snip)


I am certainly not here to tell people they can't drink or smoke. If I do, they can disprove me in 10 seconds. If someone else can do it and like their life, more power to them.

I like a lot of what you say, and you and I are a lot alike. But I am not in the "it is OK to slip, just come back" group. It will turn out OK if you come back  and stay stopped the next time, presuming you survive.

No, I NEVER said "Go ahead and slip", but yes if you REALLY have decided to quit, and you make a mistake following which you continue to QUIT falling down IS OK, AND one (although not happy about the slip) should forgive themselves rather than mercilessly beat on themselves. It's important to realize that slipping isn't failing UNLESS you start smoking as a result, and don't view the *slip* as anything other than "a moment of extreme weakness" which you learn from !  BUT, slipping certainly should be the LAST thing anyone willingly allows to happen. I said to beat yourself up and resign over a slip is self-defeating.  I said "Continue to quit", and don't submit to the compulsive mindset that "slip means go buy carton and start". Quitting is the decision made, despite a slip assuming it happens. You don't leave the option open to start again. You view the slip (if it happens) as part of the illness, and continue your goal to live the rest of your life as a non-smoker !  Same with drinking ! Too many beat the xit out've themselves rather than forgive themselves and that's a problem that often buries all positive efforts to the point of the slip.
NOT succumbing to the all/none behaviour, but saying,  "I royally F'd up, and I DO NOT want this for myself, I want to be the quitter, and not start up again."  A person either decides to quit, or does not !  Once the decision is made, and the person can legitimately say "I quit" the person has quit despite a slip.  You don't beat yourself up and say "See I can't do it, I inhaled once so I quit quitting, I'm doomed, I'm weak".

You go into this knowing this is hard as hell, and IF you fall doing something THIS difficult, you don't use that as a means to say "I can't do this".  That's self-defeating and erroneous (stinking thinking so-to-speak ) !  This is my point.  You don't make a business of quitting.  You make the decision to quit and give THAT 100% and if you slip you STILL give quitting 100% and realize that the addiction is an illness that's going to play MANY headgames to get you to start again, in fact "The mind will be out to trick you", and that's scary. But, as humans we can't always be 100%

I understand what you are saying however   I really do.  Point being the addictive/dependent individual has a mental AND physical dependence regardless what the substance is, and this person is, or becomes compulsive.  The behaviour patterns are compulsive. While the decision to STOP must be absolute, one needs to realize that IF they slip, they are best NOT to view this as "I can't quit therefore I must start again" because realistically, thats part of the compulsive game the mind plays with we addicts. Instead, Assuming they have decided to quit, climb back up, and continue quitting.  The problem is many that resume smoking or drinking or drugging gave up *quitting*, it's often a subconscious choice and THAT'S where this all gets messy. The person that quits must know how amazing our minds game playing process can be once addicted.  Not being ready to quit, and starting smoking IS different than "Slipping" once the decision is made to quit.

Difference being there is a fine line between "slipping" while quitting,  and resuming smoking. It's not OK to "resume smoking" or give up quitting !

I think some of my interim banter threw off my message to Billy, Micky.  What I was in essence saying was



By needing to stop, I meant NOW, today, and always.. Not a week from tuesday !  Assuming the person HAS QUIT,  slipping must not mean "Resuming".

Quitting is a fight,  If you get knocked on your (@$%&#!) you stand right back up and start swinging again !  your goal is to beat this xit, and not let it attack you.  What so friggin scary and confusing is that in this particular case IT is internal, we are battling part of our own mind.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

So the compulsive pattern still is around, but we find safer means of dealing with it. We can walk off stress,  we can post 10,000 posts in Karaoke Scene (HAHAHA)

Hey billy,  don't light up,  that won't happen to you !!!!  LMAO

One other thing on a serious note however.  A friend I have who specializes in eating disorders and and compulsive behaviour gave me a really interesting tidbit of information on a means to deal with certain events that will popup while you folks quit smoking.  It's basically a Gestalt type method which essentially works like this

The mind WILL play games, we are going to feel temptation and all sorts of weird processes are going to try to fool us into starting smoking, drinking (you name it) BUT Be aware of this, wait for it to happen, and watch it as it happens, and say; "LOOK at my mind trying so hard to F me up and get me to smoke" and try to be introspective enough to keep SOME detachment from the addictive mindset. Instead try to watch how our addictive minds play headgames with us (rather than succumb to this tug-o-war), but be prepared for a part of our mind we weren't quite aware of when it was "getting it's way" and not throwing this tantrum ! There's a part of our mind that like a kid that doesn't get it's way throws a hissy fit, and says
"Give me a ciggy now Kappy or I'm going to (@$%&#!) nag you relentlessly like a three year old kid that wants a toy"

In this particular case since this is a typical concern during times of heightened anxiety


As I stated, NOW is not the time to be thinking about smoke-filled bars, or torture youself by projecting yourself into such an environment when you are THIS vulnerable ! That's inundating yourself with stimuli you DO NOT need now with an already full-plate.  Now is a time to rest and recover.  When you feel better, AT THAT POINT you will either decide you can go into the environment and not smoke,  or NOT go into the environment assuming the risk is too great you will start smoking. You'll do what YOU need to do to lead a life as a non-smoker because realistically, you have to quit now and you know it.  You'll do the right thing if and when the time comes.  Don't worry about something that's not about to happen now.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

It's been almost a month. He's done taking the pills too. I guess they really did help. When he first started taking the pills he was still smoking, which is why they were effective. He says he's "done!"

Stay strong Billy.

But I really, really, disagree with you. There are no mistakes. You know deep
down in your heart that to use is not right. It is a question of making a
decision.

And when it comes to alcohol and an alcoholic, making a "mistake" may indeed
be the end of the world. If you count being buried six feet under being the
end of the world.


Absolutely disagree. Quitting is a decision. It is not a fight. If you think
you can "be strong" and fight alcohol, I think you are crazy. You can't fight
a chemical -- if you drink cyanide you will die, no matter how much you try to
"be strong".

If it becomes a fight, you and nicotine, mano y mano, on a daily basis, you
are doomed. Michael Jordan didn't go 82-0 in a basketball season, and I
guarantee I can't go 365-0 against nicotine. The key is to not make it a fight
any more, and the way to do that is make a decision and affirm it every day.

Addiction doesn't know from momentum. You are or you aren't. You can't fight
those chemicals.

I've said my piece. If you think a slip should be taken as a matter of course and you should make a habit of perservering if you do, fine. I think that is crazy. When it comes to addiction, either you are 100% off of it or you aren't.

i have to disagree, to me fighting something like that is just another way of having a positive attitude, and if u don't have one u may as well quit going in.... Billy

hey Billy hon  am glad to see you are on the better side of your health scare...I asked Milo to snog ya on my behalf From this smoker to you Hope you suceed with your challenge

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

hiiiii morgan, not sure what a snog is but it sounds good....l...and if she's giveum i'll take 2.....ty so much for ur reply, means alot....

i'm not sure how a person should look at this....is it, i quit so i'm not a smoker rrrrr  i'm quitting so i'm not smoking now.....for me it's i quit and that's it....tc hun...huggs  Billy

Almost all of us that have fought a life of multiple addictions KNOW that no matter how strong our will to win is there are powerful, and VERY nasty addictive forces within our mind that plot against us. In fact MOST people quit at least three times before finally finding a way to stop for good (regarding cigarettes). Billy is tough,  he's going to fight hard, and he'll win because he knows when he's determined to win big, he's been able to in the past in other areas, he has the ability to compete, and compete well.  Remember Cassious Clay when he was pinned against the ropes taking blows ?  He took them, and came back fighting.  Taking a beating and standing ALSO is fighting !  Being antsy, pi$$ed off at everyone and everything is part of being against the ropes.. BUT, at least he's NOT smoking for now, so this is how the process begins, and it lasts. It IS a fight, because you are determined to stay standing !  You need to be stubborn, and tenacious.

This means you DO NOT give up !  Assuming a "slip" meant you can't quit, HOW the heck could people ever quit ?  Your premise isn't rational Micky.  The conviction going into this battle IS to quit and beat the addiction. To fight not a substance, but the part of OUR OWN MIND, that is determined to have the substance even though we KNOW it's extremely destructive to the human body and in time can and will kill us !  Or DO WE know this ? Some must learn this by close call, and not others experience.   We must know we have to stop, AND REALLY want to stop ! But this alone makes NO part of the process easy !



Humans are NOT "Gods". To minimize the difficulty of the quitting process given how long the acute craving lasts (and the acute craving lasts a LONG time following the decision to quit) isn't viewing this realistically. Are you aware of the games our minds play on us and the confusion that transpires in an addictive mind, the battling that takes place within our mind ? Do you really know of nobody that's quit, during the process had a weak and crazy moment, forgiven themselves, but got back on the horse after falling knowing "they've quit" and just had a "crazy weak" moment but they WILL NOT succumb to this moment or "slip" with the all/none compulsive pattern that dictates "If you slip you automatically start smoking" type of defeat ? Thats just wrong and part of crazy thinking !



That too is arguable because decisions are never carved in stone, they are judgements and considerations only at a given time period. like all else they change in accordance to what life throws at us.  It's Conviction and tenacity and using our compulsive mindset to form obduracy that makes this struggle a fight, It's KNOWING with EVERY part of our being that we HAVE TO stop in order to live !  How logical is it to call the process "just a decision" and expect that alone will sustain us during the rollercoaster of games our mind's going to play that we are not yet aware of ?  I stated quitting is a decision and a fight it's a struggle and the goal is to win ! It's implementing a different mindset that will enable us to change something that's VERY difficult to change, and that requires a type of warrior mindset . In fact in this particular fight the opponent (addictive part of us) gets so outright dirty, that we must often ask for help to join us in the ring (which really is only OUR OWN head). The boxer makes the decision to get into the ring. After that it's "fight time". Our minds deal us some nasty blows, and even at times sucker punches.  To not be prepared for an opponent that fights dirty is to not know how to fight this "no holds barred" dirty opponent that at times will go as far as to bite our ear to get us to hurt (that's a Tyson-like metaphor ) (the addicted part of our mind fights no holds barred). The addict must know that at times "Our mind is out to get us" and this can make odds winning slim IF not prepared.  Our opponent also has an agenda NOT to lose, and it's M.O. is to trick us into losing. BUT, knowing how this works we won't succumb !
If we get hit from a direction we didn't anticipate and fall, we stand up swinging again showing we're tough, and won't fall for that particular sucker punch next time !
We learn in time what our addictive minds fight-style is, and adapt our own fight style accordingly. If you allow one or two punches to the head to scare you, and defeat you, you never had a realistic concept of how fighting works.  If you are 100% certain you are NEVER going to lose,  you WILL quit and pout because fighting never means an easy win is guaranteed. If you somehow get knocked on your (@$%&#!),  you realize that your opponent is really cheating badly, and ask for help fighting this dirty opponent you are stuck in the ring with !  This is anything but a fun process ! If you think a battle means entering the ring and just standing there with NO offense, or defensive strategy, you CAN'T quit !  This is TRULY a battle ! Because fight or not, you are getting beat up by an addiction. You make the decision to FIGHT BACK !

The boxer if they get hit and SLIP gets off the mat and doesn't allow himself to lay down for a 10 count and lose, you continue determined to beat this addiction, and ALSO learn how to role with certain punches, it's a technique, not a god given and granted win for us !


I wasn't aware how easy giving up addiction was for you ! Did it just fall into your lap ? I'm STILL in the ring with an opponent that refuses to loose, my opponent also has that same agenda to win, and even after I assumed the match was over, to open my door without looking when the doorbell rings might be to get shot by a sour opponent who fights by it's OWN set of rules, and not fairly..  My compulsive addictive mind is a VERY dirty fighter, and HATES to lose !  The "addicts" mind is the ring where the fight takes place. I vote for sobriety (meaning I'm also a spectator at my own fight) however I KNOW not ALL have an easy time in their own rings. You go into this with a positive attitude.  You go into this knowing it's a battle but unfortuneatly not as quick in duration as a boxing match. It's a fight that requires extreme tenacity and preparation !
So,  How is "it not a fight" once the decision to quit is made ? I quit drinking 27 years ago this month.  My mind still plays games and says "See Kappy, If you had a few drinks, you wouldn't have to deal with this fear, because I can make it go away".


I stated "hang around the germ you will be sick". Nicotine is a germ that has made us ill. You ask for, and make NO guarantees.  You stated this yourself ! You stay away from the substance but the insidious nature of the illness of addiction itself makes this brutally difficult. "Ulysses and the Siren" type analogy. If you slip up you should shoot yourself ?  Of course not !
This is why MOST must at times ask their higher power to help them, or supportive network to help them because MOST HAVE been going 365-0 against nicotine, that's what's been happening to MOST that smoke !  Nicotine doesn't fight clean, It doesn't even fight, it addicts because our body and mind aren't perfect.  It's an extremely addictive substance to we humans, and once addicted, we fight our craving for the substance, not the Nicotine, You ARE NOT fighting that little white stick. It doesn't have the ability to fight. But the part of our mind that enables us to become addicted is quite a warrior, and like a bratty little "inner kid" (@$%&#!) around relentlessly. That battle is within !  And if not prepared it's pretty ugly odds if you ask me !  But,  I'm going to be a warrior to, and like the ant not succumb due to my small size ! I'll carry away that damn piece of wood obstructing my ant hole even though it weights many times more than me.

In my case Micky,  I have no God,  I believe in nothing, trust almost nobody or anything, but part of me is too stubborn to die.  My odds of not dieing were slim to none. I'm going to give ME full credit for winning this fight, because I got very little help. I didn't ask anybody or any diety for help.. In my case I applied my street sense AGAINST this addictive mindset, even if it meant there were days I wasn't going to get out've bed because I realized these were days I'd get pummeled in the ring. I'm determined to win the fight and believe me,  it's a fight and you know this as well !



.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

But the healthy part of our mind we are trying to nurture DOES.

That's the PHYSICAL process of "being addicted to substance". Once we dry out (which is the easy part today with medications to help reduce the first several day acute phase in the cases of alcohol)  The behavioural HELL begins.  It's ALL part of the process the addict goes thru. Addiction is NOT JUST PHYSICAL OR MENTAL, it's physiological. It's who and what we are, or have become. We must own up to the fact it's OUR OWN problem.  Nothing done to us by some substance that raped us. We started indulging in a poison, and did damage, so we must stop. But the dependent personality and compulsive individual has a VERY different mountain ahead that must be pushed.
While addiction to substance becomes a part of our being too that CAN be beaten when we learn how to fight it. For "The Addict", it's not as simple as you are making it appear. Without making life changes the addict merely displaces one bad pattern with another assuming they do not make behaviour changes.
Chemicals can't fight.  They could care less if you ingest them or not.  But there's a certain "being" that shares our body and mind that insists on drinking and drugging under our roof despite what the rules are, and unfortuneately getting a restraining order from this addictive mindset is impossible,  we are forced to deal with the inner addict. As individuals we are complex beings with many different things happening in our brain and mind simultaneously.  The addict is at a tug-o-war.



All the more reason to not allow yourself to lose this vicious fight !  The fighter has knowledge of the rules, and risks involved !  Some die in the ring ! But more die because they live everyday of their life allowing their opponent to throw wild punches thinking "This is OK" without ever fighting back.  

When you are addicted you ARE in a ring.  You can either fight back, or just get pummeled and resign yourself to the fact that the dizziness you feel getting pelted repeatedly in the head from the blows feels good because it takes your mind off've other stuff !  So does death.   The decision is to live and why ?  That's up to the individual.  Not all value life as much.

There are NEVER guarantee's the addict can win over the course of a lifetime !
"Just for today". You do EVERYTHING you possibly can to NOT slip. If the day god forbid comes you do. You view it as "A slip" and look ahead saying "I'm NEVER going to let that happen again".  IF a mistake happens, you don't have to throw in the towel !  The decision to "live sober" starts the process. Staying sober is the commitment and can happen EVEN if a mistake is made.  Living as a non-smoker is a similar mindset !



Micky,

ANY WAY that enables you to stay substance free as long as YOU recognise that's what you need to do for you is the correct way.  It's not about me being correct, or my truth, or what works for me. It's not about me defending what works for me, and the last thing it's about for me is ego. It's about ONE thing, Staying sober HOWEVER I must do it "For now". It's the same way for you.

                                                                           Good luck with this ____
                                                                            (call it what you wish)



Yep,  This is the double-edged sword many of us use as a quick way to the grave.  Beat ourselves up for being human while overlooking the immense accomplishment we've made in quitting one of the three strongest addictive substances known to man. It's not enough we've quit, but we must be perfect too !

This is EXACTLY why you don't beat yourself up *IF* you slip Micky.  You commend yourself for quitting, look at the slip as illness, and do EVERYTHING you can to NOT start smoking.

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I just called Billy's house.  Somebody picked up and said

"Billy,  Telephone"

Than suddenly I heard this

"I don't give a *$&# (@*#)$, shut the $(%)# ($."  and I heard things smashing in the background.  I figured my timing might've been bad so I hung up saying  "Tell him it's Phill from KS".  I hope he's able to pull this quitting stuff off  :shock:

_________________
Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

This is my last reply.

You are trying to use logic on something which defies logic. Anyone can see that alcoholics shouldn't drink -- it isn't logical when it destroys their lives. Yet they do drink, and at the darnedest times too. Self-knowledge does no good at all.

There is no healthy part of my mind when I am in my addiction. That is like saying "drink responsibly". What a bunch of hooey. You can't drink responsibly -- it works on the judgement center of the brain.

You want to fight -- fine. I know I have to cease fighting, because I can't win a fight against a chemical. If I get on the battlefield with it, I am going to lose. So I don't get on the battlefield with it.

You go on and on putting words in my mouth (so-to-speak) disagreeing with something I never stated ! So what are you DISAGREEING with ????  The smoker trying desperately to quit but over time during a slip (period of weak will) is unforgiveable, assuming they get back up and don't smoke again ?   Taking  "a drag" is the same as the alcoholic who might "Die of alcohol toxicity"? You throw sentences around that don't relate to anything I stated in context. The intent is NEVER to weaken, but at times people do, and will. That doesn't mean they resume the addiction if dealt with in certain manners.  Who EVER said "A slip is OK" ?  I said it's forgiveable, and NEED NOT be a new beginning for heavy smoking !!  But no,  "You disagree", "you disagree".  With what ??  Your posts continue repeating your disagreement but aren't even disagreeing with my content, instead remaining obstinate without regard for my responses to you. Yes they are long-winded, but sometimes that's the best I can do in hopes of substantiating something to avoid people such as yourself making certain judgment statements out've context repeatedly. So while you are free to make all posts "your last post", ALL you've stated is "I disagree I really disagree" when in fact you are disgreeing with NOTHING I actually stated.  If I say, Assuming the quitter makes a mistake in context, you respond "you better not ever make a mistake" (or something equally as ludicrous). That's fine as a "plan", but in life we make mistakes. I NEVER stated what works for me is right for you. I never stated "Go ahead slip, what the heck!". Besides your challenging EVERYTHING, What constructive help have you offered in this thread to a recent non-smoker ? I'm not interested in what you tell people, you're quite negative,  tell somebody who requests your "sage" to me you really appear to speak from tunnel-vision. Stay sober do what works for you, but if you can't listen to others responses to questions you ask, don't ask questions to just in turn "judge".  You asked me questions and obviously had no interest in hearing what works for me, instead you judge it as "That's crazy". Will since you're a know-it-all, and so :sane: and impervious to error your lucky. Why should I, or anyone else care "If I'm the first person *you know*" a method you don't even wish to understand "has ever worked for" ? It's worked for me, many others, and is NOT my own method. You say it's not a "fight" to remain substance free.  Well I suppose your an expert and have a right to make a broad statement such as that ? You've offered no information on "your secret" instead refute others methods.  I formulated a means that works FOR ME from years of help from others. If your an expert, stay sober and try to improve the quality of your own life, without impinging your negativity on those of us that believe we are more than robots who have no will to stay sober, and will never apply logic to the process. I'm an addict who's off substance. I'm not a "drunk".  Don't challenge those with years more sobriety under their belt assuming they've never questioned you, or challenged what works for you.  What's important is what works for you, so qualify it as such, and back off, don't call others "crazy" who have applied a method that's enabled them sobriety FAR longer than yourself.  Agree or disagree, what I stated is behaviour mod method that works for quite a few. Who stated "slip every-so-often" ?  That's still smoking.  Get out've your all/none world long enough to TRY to comprehend that a mistake need not be the end of everybodies world, and a rationalization to commence substance. People "slip", it's never a happy choice, or on ones wishlist *IF* this happens at all. Certainly don't regurgitate what I HAVE NEVER stated. A person can still have QUIT, and forgive a "slip". Do you have over 20 years of being smoke-free ?  Well assuming you did, you'd realize we make choices ! If this isn't a fight for you, great.  Don't discredit those of us who are :fighting addiction: that's horribly rude ! Mistakes happen, there's little rational about your responses as they pertain contextually to what's been stated and explained. Twelve step 101 doesn't pertain to ALL of life as an addict once behaviour modification technique needs to be applied and the struggle in a grey world begins.  I answered your question about my past however this is a thread regarding, "STOPPED SMOKING". This isn't about the active drunk. Your statement "First person you know", is fine but you apparently live in a world quite different from me because MOST I know that finally quit have quit, and *sometimes* a person DOES make a mistake, that's what was being addressed, the concern "What if I make a mistake", naturally the response is you do ALL you can not to, but if this happens then what ?  Castigate them ?  You stick to your premise of "You can never slip because you will go out and buy a carton again", in the real world of the addict a slip need not be dealt with that way assuming the decision, and commitment has been made despite the "weak-willed" moment, but when I qualify my statement you still insist that I am saying "It's OK to slip". I NEVER stated such a thing  I stated there can be life after getting knocked down assuming the mindset is a certain way for the smoker.  Don't impinge "A slip up" for the smoker or anyone as being unforgiveable sin no different than actively starting a drunken binge. In time as sober addicts we MUST learn life can be grey and a mistake need NOT be resuming a pattern as a 3 pack a day smoker, and when it's time for behavioural changes after the intial "I WILL NEVER SMOKE AGAIN" phase is over, sucker punches roll in and we FORGET certain things so YES, you MUST know how the mind works and understand basic principles, otherwise the compulsive person quits smoking, and starts compulsively eating, or gambling, womanizing, you name it.  It's a life problem, not just ONE substance ! But no, you regurgitate "You disagree", With what ?   My truth has worked for me 27 years after quitting alcohol, Heroin and other substances (a dfferent topic but I was answering YOUR question to me) WITH one day's slip in 1983 regarding alcohol. When I slipped, I OPTED to forgive myself and *I* HAVE NOT had a drop since. I don't need or care what a nay-sayer such as you thinks, NOR do I care whether or not an individual such as yourself believes what I state to be accurate, OR My coping skills, and methods aren't up for challenge. You are certainly brazen to imply how I've done this as being "crazy", you have no right to question behaviour modification technique as being accurate.  That's arrogant. I'm not challenging you about your being alcoholic, that's your own business. I'm stating that rather than taking what you can use, and leaving this rest regarding methods that have worked for others, twisting out've context what they state (to perpetually "disagree with") and parroting in essence "You better be perfect" repeating AA 101 concepts.  Your repetitive out've context statements are encouraging a new non-smoker how ? You don't have to agree with anything, but WHAT have you in turn offered that's constructive and encouraging ?  The desire to assume a certain amount of control is an option during behavioural phases of being Smoke-free, but no,  you say "the addict has no control over the substance".  What the hell does THAT have to do with the person who has given up smoking and is dedicating to living a smoke-free life ? Understanding our minds, and establishing coping mechanisms is IMPORTANT for many. What has worked for me is an anomaly to some as stated so what are you challenging ? What are you offering ? The principles of "Petting yourself on the back" for making progress DESPITE a slip eludes you?  You wish to punish yourself for gaining weight after quitting smoking yet still tell me that you advise others ?  Well that's YOUR problem sir.  Beat yourself up, and punish all around you, Live in your ideal world and remain a perfectionist but allow others to be human. I said life is long and hard and mistakes can be survived. You insist that "Slipping is the same as starting up and buying a carton"?  Well there's a BIG difference my friend !  But in your All/None world perhaps there isn't. Assuming what you say were so,  Many of us would still be smoking even after multiple attempts at quitting, but when it was MY TIME to quit, I continued struggling to overcome my addiction determined to quit, and I finally did it looking back 20 years smoke-free with no slips, UNLIKE the first handful of attempts. You have the option to live the rest of your life as a person who wishes to assume NO control during weeks and months and even decades to follow.  Nobody has challenged that.  Yet if you disagree with something at least have the courtesy to challenge what's ACTUALLY been stated, or qualify what works for you as *your truth* without casting judgement.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Amen Kappy!! Agree with everything you said here...  I am smoking again after 4 months of not smoking.. I am so unhapppy that I started again.. And the weird thing is that I have quit drugs with no problem before. But it seems this one is harder. I am on the verge of quitting again and I hope any pray that it sticks this time... I have to do this for me.. Not anyone else... I could quit for someone else but I have to do it for me and that is the only way it will work...


You need keep one doing this.. It is the right thing to do... And just an update to everyone here...Both of my parents who were smoking 4 packs a day for over 40 years are still smoke free!! This has been since Feb this year!!!!  I am so thankful that they are still on the right track.. And remarkably enough they are feeling great and have been able to get off some other medications because they quit smoking.. I am so proud of them.....

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Will sing or fish for food!!I'm not quite right!!

That's great news Sharon.  Similarly, NEVER give up the fight to quit ! Or believe that JUST because you started again this time, doesn't mean you can't quit if you try again !!  For whatever reason given this insidious addiction and our changing body chemistry, JUST because you started again THIS time, doesn't mean you can't quit again and succeed !  You have the choice of quitting again !  You fell off the horse, and in your case the worst thing that happened is you started smoking again up to now..  Quit again, don't settle for not being able to quit because you didn't succeed once or twice, or EVEN three times in the past !

There's just a few things that you have to REALLY REALLY know with every ounce of your being, and that's  "Do I REALLY want to quit, do I KNOW I have to, am I really sick of this habit, am I willing to face the extreme discomfort I might feel for a time to come, am I doing this because *I* MUST"?  and you must honestly be able to say YES.  With support, and a LOT of knowledge, and HONEST commitment to quit, you CAN'T say "I didn't succeed twice before, I'm destined to live life as a smoker", That's erroneous, it's part of the addictive mindset and game that transpires.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Billy Look deep into my eyes................

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Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Sheeesh,  I thought we were trying to help the guy quit !  Not scare him into starting again, and needing to pop all sorts of pills in addition and drink !  

That's almost as scary as my saying,  "Once you quit, you can displace the void with healthy things such as 10,000 posts in KS"  :(

I wonder what the status of this has been
http://billstatus.ls.state.ms.us/docume ... 0162IN.htm

ADDED IN:

Filling what will be a BIG void is something REALLY important !!  This is where hobbies, clubs, especially things that are going to keep the "hand to mouth" action occupied are important.  For me it was always (for some reason) tonic water.. Strangest thing I found out later (but never knew this at the time), was why I was loading up on Tonic water, yet little else worked..  Found out later that Quinine is a natural heart relaxant (or something like that).  Seems my body always found "the drug" in something

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".