Karaoke Forums

I just got off the phone with a friend of mine and we both used to KJ shows. We got onto the subject and discussed this at length but couldn't come to a definite conclusion. I live in San FRancisco. At some of the larger places they will count it as a turn if you "get up" to sing whether as a solo or to do a duet with someone.

The REALLY sticky part is- sometimes you may have turned a song YOU chose and wanted to sing- then someone asks you to sing with them. You'd rather sing your solo choice but don''t want to hurt the feelings of the duet requester. In these places the host makes you choose which song you want. Do you suck it up and sing the duet even though in MANY of these places "THAT" will be the only song you get to do in an evening. Any ideas on how to gracefully handle it -either with the KJ or the duet requester?

So wondering IS a duet a turn? And if not where does the limit stop? I've been at other shows as a singer when it took 2 hours or more to get up...and meanwhile there was another person that got up 5 or 6 times as either solo,or part of a duet or trio in a single rotation. I could hear all the tables around me commenting on it. Which place is right?

Anyone(KJ's)  found a formula that works...or if you are a singer..what are your thoughts about "fair" practice in this matter!

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its a turn in my book...I learned this early on when I kj'ed and the whole local netball team would come in and put their names down individually one after another then all of them would want to get up and sing every song...the furor when I put a stop to it was unbelievable. I inherited the name vinegar tits But fairs fair, if one person got up to sing that would be fine I would follow the rotate...the moment the team made a move to those mics then the rest of the names slid down the list

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"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

you know, other than rotation management (insert singers at the end of a rotation, or insert them every other singer, etc), I can't think of a more hotly debated topic.

Because no matter how you look at it... it's right for SOMEONE!

SOME KJ is going to like a single turn per person... and some are going to care about a song is the part of the rotation, not the singer... so no matter who sings, it's one person's turn, not the duet/trio, etc...

I used to allow duets and I'd say on the mic "this is Bob's turn, and Sue's going to help him out"... didn't really matter to much to me, I looked at it as so many songs played a night.

But you get folks that love to sing A LOT, and henceforth can end up ruining a show... "jeez, she gets up to sing 7-10 times in a 15 person rotation!! Why is she so special?" Next thing you know, you got 15 Betty's that want to sing with others, and it's total mass chaos.

Some can come up with rules like "one duet per person" to eliminate this... others do the a duet is a turn for both singers... some don't like that many rules because it takes away from the spontaneous fun of the moment when you get a table full of folks that want to sing with each other...

Thru hard earned experience, I came up with the duet is a turn for both singers, to eliminate what is perceived by many to be apparant favoritism.

No hard fast rule really applies equally to everyone - everywhere! Most kjs just have to kinda muddle through it and find out what works best for them!

...I figured that it must be a hot topic because it's been 17 YEARS ans me and my friend STILL haven't come to a hard and fast agreement about it. As a singer if forced to choose I will usually tell the duet requester that I would love to sing with them- but I have already put in for another song and if they want to sing with me they will be moved to the back of the rotation after that initial song with me as well. If the rotation is as big as it usually is at the shows in the city..that puts and end to it.. But...!

Garsh! You & Morgan/Vikki sue did bring back some memories I can't decide if I'd like to forget or not. We had an entire rugby team in once and they were breaking beer bottles on their heads and I had to kick em out for shaking up beer then spraying the crowd( and my monitors) and Oh God....BIKER week....imagine 50,000 harley riders hitting town ...THAT was a nightmare/lots of fun! (winkwink) But those group requests could and did get out of hand. I think I finally made the rule only 3 mics and no more than 5 total performers. Duets counted as a turn and in larger groups or cases where there were back up singers and a lead- I think I counted it as a turn for the lead.

Smile...kind of nice to know that SOME things never change!

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For my rounds a duet counts as a turn for both.  If you already have a song up & the other person puts you up with them I will go ask YOU if that's what you want to do because that will be your turn, if you decline & agree, the duet will get stuck into the next round, if you do not want to do it, the duet gets thrown out!
I used to allow (when I started) if a duet got up, they would still have their individual spot, it soon got taken advantage of

Vicki
Dave & Vicki
Tom & Ray
Ray & Vicki
Ed & Ray

etc....
Even though TECHNICALLY, these are 5 individual spots (and some will argue that who cares what they do with their spot), 2 people got up 3 times in 1 round (or more as this is a small scale example) & it seems to those who have no duets up unfair (ESPECIALLY in large rotations) as they only get up once.  On a slow night I MIGHT let it slide on occasion, but as a rule no.

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Because our rotation system is very different, duet is counted as a turn for the person who turn in the request slip; the other person can sing again in that rotation.

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I can neither confirm nor deny ever having or knowing anything about nothing.... mrscott

Personally I get sick of people who constantly turn in these 5 and 6-minute dirges to sing. I tend to sing songs of less than 4 minutes, and have quite a few at less than 3.

I thought that if I ever started a regular gig, I would post rules for rotation in the book.

   * After your second song over 5 minutes, you skip a turn.
   * After your second song under 3 minutes, you get an extra song if you want.
   * You have a short period to make it to the stage, or you skip a turn. If it gets to the second "going" and you aren't on the way to the stage, you will be gone.

If crowded:

   * One duet per night, after that it's your turn.

I've been asked to do duets many times, and not wanting to hurt someone's feelings, I usually accepted. There have been times, when the KJ has taken that for my turn, much to my displeasure. A song takes up the same amount of time no matter how many people sing it, but if you are going to count a duet as both singer's turns, it should be clearly posted, or widely known, and announced throughout the evening. Once again as mentioned, I hope this rule would change as to the size of the rotation, but I personally would rarely count both singers, except when I thought they were over doing it.
As for long songs, I've thought about using a fade out at the 3 or 4 minute mark, during heavy rotations. This I would post, or make known throughout the evening...........but I've never had the balls to try it....

Nah if it's in the book, then it's fair game.  The only time it really bugs me is if i'm in a pinch for time at the end of the night - but that's the way it goes.  I've been to a couple shows that did something similar with the over 5 minute songs, except one would literally STOP the song AT 5 minutes whether you were in the middle of a verse, chorus, etc, didn't matter, music was done at 5 minutes & the other didn't list anything longer than 5 minutes in the books.  Neither are still in business.  I don't know if i'd stay at a show if my song happened to be slightly over 5 minutes & I was told to si out an entire round, or I would just continue to search for under 3 minute songs to keep getting an extra turn - although not sure what the difference there would be if I did 2 under 3 minute songs or 1 5-6 minute song.  MANY songs of today are at the 5 minute marks & ESPECIALLY hits from the 70's & 80's.

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It would only be the second song where it takes effect, and even then only in the third round. It probably isn't workable, but maybe I could call it the 10-minute rule. You get up to 10 minutes in two rounds to sing.

I can see that it would be a bit of a pain to administer. But it would be justice.

this is how we run it as well.  our group is pretty much like family so everyone sings with everyone else all night anyway.

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All work and no play make Homer something something

I use a duet to encourage new singers to get on stage, so my regular KJ doesnt cut me out of the rotation..

That's right, I'm not a KJ..  LMAO

That's the way it is here too. Just last night I sang 4 songs with other people, besides having my own turn in the rotation. It was their request slip turned in, so it was not counted as my turn. But they were both girls, who are normally pretty shy about singing, and asked me to help them with their songs. (cause apparently these people think I'm brave or something, Lol, which is so not true) In situations like that, I don't generally sing into the mic anyhow, I'm standing up there to be their moral support only,(cause they're karaoke chickens)  :D , and I only pull my mic up if they get lost in the song.

I would actually be kinda mad if a KJ made me count something like that as MY turn.
Now, if I were a... ahem... DIVA... And brought friends in and got them drunk and up on stage just so I could get up and hog the mic from them every time- then I would expect a KJ to say I was getting too many turns. I've seen people like that. But it just don't happen in the two local places I go to... it's very much a family atmosphere here, and none of the KJ's would take an occasional duet as BOTH singers' turn.

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

OMG.. y'all just brought up something I had forgotten...TIME LIMIT! Can I fee up that I put nail polish on on or two LOOOOOONG songs That I just couldn't take?? (They of course wouldn't play- and the singer had to pick another one) Am I BAD or what? Roxanne was the main one! Sting if heer were dead owuld roll over at the caterwallin THAT song seemed to produce. Raaaaaawwwwwwxxxxxxx Annee Yoooooo don have to pudontha red light! GAD I HATE that  song!

There was also an 11 minute version of stairway to heaven. ELEVEN FREAKING MINUTES! There was a waiter names David Palomaris who NAILED it..but we had a discussion and ended up with this agreement- "that" was the only song he sang unless he did a duet or two...and it was the LAST sing of the night." He was flattered to close the show...the singers waiting  to sing didn't mind because it was the Last song..and I loved it because- even though David RAWKED that song - it would clear the room because it was so long.

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You know, I too have a problem with those incredibly long karaoke songs. Not so much the singing, as when they have those huge musical breaks. There's a girl who does a few rocker songs at my place (fortunately, she's not there very often).. and they are 5-6 minutes, one has a terribly long musical break.

Tons of the bluegrass songs I like to sing are that way also. Bluegrass is notorious for an instrumental break in between each & every verse/chorus. So I simply don't sing those songs as often.

I personally think the karaoke companies should shorten those at least- maybe eliminate a few of the instrumental breaks even. I mean, it IS all about singing... not the guitar or fiddle lead.  :D Live music.. it's fine. But not in a karaoke setting, IMO.

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

Yep, a duet is a song for BOTH singers. And talk about long songs. I have taken Gordon Lightfoot's "The Wreck Of The Edmund Fitzgerald" out of my book. And Marty Robbin's "El Paso" is next.

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Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

We have a local who will ALWAYS get up to do that song (pardon me, I do NOT know the name of it)... that goes "Lord wont you buy me, a Mercedes Benz"... a capella. THAT is a stupidly long song, made all the more irritating because there is not even a good rythm do drown yourself in to try and ignore the monotony of the singer.

I wish the KJ could tell her that it's GOT to be a "karaoke" song.... but I guess that would be rudeness.

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

Hmmm... I just googled that to break my curiosity. Janis Joplin-Mercedes Benz.

Funny thing though, it's not such a long song. Maybe the gal at karaoke repeats the whole song, who knows? But I swear it seems forever and a day by the time she's done with it.  :banghead:

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

While we're at it, Total Eclipse Of The Heart has got to go too!  :yes:   A duet should count as a turn for each singer unless one of the singers has a very short singing section.

Well..... !^%#@%*..... who asked you?




J/K.... Where ya been all day Don?

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥