Karaoke Forums

What would you say your normal Vocal to Music mix would be

a) Vocals way over Music
b) Vocals a little over music
c) Vocal under music

Reason for my question - I have a regular singer who sings mostly rock songs
This guy has a STROOONG VOICE and I know if I don't make any adjustments his voice is LOUD LOUD LOUD.   Unfortunatley this is what HE likes !   I have tried on occasions to adjust the gain and volume to where his voice was perfetcly mixed with the music ( at least what I think).  Sounded like a recording.  - This is the sound I go for when I sing.  Usually I just accomplish this myself with proper mic techniques ..BUT ...  Whenever I turn down the vocals HE complains !  or asks if the battery needs replacing on the wireless  etc.  

Do most singers WANT to have the vocals WAY OUT THERE overpowering the music volume?????   What do you think ?

I will mix to how I feel it sounds good.  Vocals JUST over the music where they cut through but aren't overpowering.  If they want more vocals I turn them up separately in the monitor so the main mix isn't affected.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

We have the opposite problem There are a couple of new singers that I can never seem to get enough vocal level. The stage mics are sm58 and a shure access1. They both need close proximity for "quiet" singers yet I cant get them to eat the mic. There is a point where feedback becomes a problem when turning the mic level up.  Im considering getting a cheaper more sensitive mic just for those types. Suggestions?

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Karyoker,

I have this same problem, with the same equipment.  What it comes down to more often than not is technique.....some people just don't understand that you have to 'eat the mic' as you put it.  Usually if I remind the same people, over and over again....sooner or later they get better.  Whenever I get new singers though, it's back to square one!  MrD

_________________
[highlight=midnightblue]MrD - KJ/DJ Specialist
Visit MrD on facebook - mrdsentertainment
& on myspace - larrynance[/highlight]

Don't get me wrong I have those QUIET singers myself ..What usually happens with thie 1 GIRL is I get her drunken Boyfriend yelling for ME to turn her up ...Like It's my fault she CAN'T sing !!!  and I'm turning her DOWN on purpose !!!  :shock:

I love this lil gal We run roxbox and between songs the singer list is displayed on the big screen and she was probably the first singer ever to pay attention to it. She came up and said I already done that song!!! HUH?  It took me a few seconds to realize what was going on. I started giggling and said I aint put you in the computer yet for the next song .

Next time I will explain the relaxing the diaphragm tecninique and relaxing and belting it out. When she does she will be awesome but it gets frustrating sometimes waiting  LOL

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

wha ti generally do is explain the need for them to hold the  mic close.  if this doesn't work, i usually turn up the gain so i get feedback, then i back it off again.  when they are done singing, i explain the reason for the feedback was that i had to turn the mic up so loud in order for thier voice to be heard.  they usually get the picture after that.

_________________
All work and no play make Homer something something

Good idea ! we're gonna try that !! We have a few that like that & a few that want to cup the mic too, I dont know why they do it, hubby says they prolly think it makes them "look kool", this causes feedback too & we try soo hard to stop it but I think next time we'll just let it go so it messes with the song & maybe they'll get the point ! It just sux we have to do that b/c then it kinda makes us seem like WE dont know what were doing ya know ? But when ya tell 'em time after time & they dont get it..what are ya gonna do ?

_________________
Kelley
Star Sounds Karaoke & Mobile Recording Studio


[shadow=black][scroll]You have to respect your audience. Without them, you're essentially standing alone, singing to yourself....KD Lang[/scroll][/shadow]

Voice slightly over Music is my preferred setting.

As far as the microphone cupper's  I set the gain to avoid feedback and if they complain I just tell them that while it looks cool to hold the mic like that, it causes feedback and if they want more volume then they will have to hold it differently, so basically it comes down to being heard or looking cool...and it's their choice.

It's usually the guys that do this and they sometimes have a hard time dealing with this info as the need to look cool overrides the sound good part.  LOL

_________________
FlipSide Karaoke
Scott

This is where the swept mid comes into play,  Set the frequency at about 1K and turn it down.  Gets rid of the cupping effect - for the most part.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

D, Vocals over music comfortably
I have found over the years there are a lot of common sense things you can do to help control vocal feedback. The human voice is between 500hz to 2khz or so. When you work with so many different singers and voices in one night, it's all but impossible not to have a touch of feedback at some point during the evening. It's inherently difficult to amplify the human voice to begin with. Then when you start twisting knobs, next thing you know you have breath consonant pops to add to the feedback situation. Feedback occures by the way since no one has really told you what you are dealing with...when the sound from your speakers and/or monitors enter your microphones, and is re-amplified. You are in essence creating a "Loop". You stop the loop, you stop the feedback. Of course you can go out and spend bucks for a EQ, both stereo for your mains, and about a 30 band mono for your monitors, or a feedback eliminator. I don't really like the feedback eliminators personally, but they do work i guess. But try some simple fixes first. Such as speaker placement, and the type of microphones you buy. And know exactly what each knob on your mixer does. You can try marking on your mixer where feedback starts, and stay just below that threshold. For karaoke, any of the Cardioid type microphones work great. You may have to change to a directional if all else fails. Type, and placement of your monitors is very very important, since they are usually closest to the singer. Keep your highs turned down, i adjust my high end last. Don't make your vocals muddy, but good bottom end, and less high actually sound better in most cases. I have gone to karaoke shows, and the vocals cut through you like a knife. No need for this really. As far as soft singers goes, about all you can do is go to selection A in your post, do this by turning the music way down. And this should make that girls boyfriend happy to. And if you just can't beat it....you may just have to turn everything down..nothing makes for a long night, and poor show, quicker then the dreaded feedback curse.

_________________
Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

I believe you are mistaken.

Even women hit A-440. My voice goes down to 100 Hz. The highest sopranos don't normally use notes above 1100 Hz for the fundamental.

Of course there are always harmonics involved, and it may be that EQ is most effective in that range. But it is not where the fundamentals are.

I was talking in general terms, but here is the approx listing for most singers.
Human voice
These are the ranges demanded in classical opera, hence the decimal point accuracy...
Type of voice Frequency range Hz
Bass 87.31 - 349.23
Baritone 98.00 - 392.00
Tenor 130 - 493.88
Contralto 130.81 - 698.46
Soprano 246.94 - 1,174.70

Then of course there is the glass breaking range...

_________________
Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

As far as vocal mix it depends on the singer. Great to good singer - vocals just above music. Horrible singer - equally mixed volume, music to voice. I find if someone is off pitch I can mask the bad sound with the music a bit. You can syill hear them, but it isn't as hard on the ears.

Whisper singers - I found moving the monitor farther away has given me a lot more control. I try boosting the main and pulling down the volume on the music only, first. I do this instead of just increasing the volume on their mic. I'll push it to the limit before I get feed back. If this doesn't work and I've explained to the singer they need to hold the mic closer, but they won't listen, I'll pull the music down way low. I'll do this even if the crowd is louder then the music needs to be set, so people can see it is not the equipment, it's the singer. I usually don't get people yelling turn them up. The crowd will yell at the singer to sing louder.

I'll take people aside and try to explain they need to get closer to the mic or possibly sing louder, but as you all know they don't listen. I swear some people just want to be on stage, but really don't want to be heard.

_________________
[shadow=pink][glow=deepskyblue]. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
[updown]~*~ MONKEY BUSINESS KARAOKE~*~ [/shadow][/updown][/glow]

Babs...you're a pro....

_________________
Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........