Karaoke Forums

Seeing as the places you go stop karaoke early, I can understand why you feel that way.  As a kj I would stop taking requests if I knew I couldn't get you up again - this bugs me more than anything, i've watched kj's take request up to the end of the night - WHAT is the point if you know you can't get all of the requests up?  We run from 9-1 or 1:30 depending on the night, my cut off time is generally 12 midnight on avg.
I've been running my method since I started and rarely hear complaints and have a pretty solid nightly following.  I am hired by the bar to accomodate everyone, not just the people that have been there all night, everyone will have at least 1 chance to sing - provided time permits, again, once I have enough slips to take out the rest of the night, I don't take anymore from new or old.  So say I have enough slips up to take me out & cut off at 12, no one new is going to be added from that point on & as long as a singer brings up their next slip when they come up to the mic to sing, they will be included in the last round of the evening (provided it was before the cut off), if they didn't happen to bring me one while they came up, then they are also out of luck for 1 more possible song.  I also try to keep lag time down between songs to get more people up (you'd be surprised how many extra you CAN get in by working the long intros/outros of songs to an advantage rather than a disadvantage), next one is always cued up & once the current singer hits their last word, I will start calling up the next singer as the current song winding down.  Most discs I know where to cue to begin music quickly, so the second you are on stage (if it's a long intro song & I see you are ready, I may call you up, then begin the song before you hit the stage), the music begins UNLESS it requires an immediate start vocally or a few clicks intro, then you'll get a second or two to prepare.  Most of our customers know to get up as soon as I call you, on occasion i'll get the stragglers.

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It also depends on the hour the first hour establishes the rotation and the last we go in to a high tempo and get the singers up as soon as possible It is during this time we will try to get everybody up As long as there is communication between the host and 'all' the singers and they know you are trying to be fair to everybody, they are satisfied...


We often have nights where all the singers have known and sang with everybody for 10 or 15 years. Most really dont care to sing every rotation and would rather listen to new singers.. It is those nights when flexibility is required, the rotation is not important and usually it is those nights that people including the crowd have the most fun. They just want music to dance to and party whether its karaoke or DJ...Sat night was almost that way and we were taking DJ requests too. Those are the nights that are remembered everybody has a smile on their face and the bartenders make the most on tips.. A good time was had by all... Karaoke can take many forms and to try to put everything in a little neat pigeion hole and apply it to all venues or crowds is a mistake.

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Glad to be back ! Thank you.

The discussion of rotation I think will always be debated.
Reading the posts I can tell different venues are dealing with different circumstances.
I have mostly regulars at my bar and it is a karaoke bar. Just about everyone sings.
I run my show from 9pm to 2am, sometimes until 3am. If I have a crowded bar the owner has me stay later, so everyone usually gets their last song in.
I stick to rotation ! I've been offered many a bribe and turned them down. People seem genuinely shocked when I turn down a $20 bill.

I respect the differences in venues and understand the way I do it wouldn't work for everyone. My point is I'm surprised that some would say they'd be so upset by the way I do it that they would actually walk out. I've just never experienced this.

Of course I would never put someone up just after they entered the door. Maybe this is more what you are talking about.

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Babs Im alot more mellow than I used to b  but If I sit there for 45 minutes or more and people are singing ahead of us that werent even in the place when we put in requests in, we will leave.  Now if its in a local haunt and ther eis alot of friends there I havnt talked to awhile I could care less if I sang or not

now if Im in a strange place and singers are singing twice before me. I will complain to mngmnt and not go back..Thats when I do get P****.  LMAO

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Rotation for me is not that big of a deal - I don't have the problem like many of you have - My rotations are at the busiest 10-15 people on an average.


BUT that being said :  The most important thing concerning busy rotations
#1- NO ONE should sing 2 songs while someone is waiting to sing their 1st
#2- If you have people waiting to sing their 1st song KJ's should not sing
#3- Be consistent in your policy

I will assure you - unless someone tries to play the 'jump on stage while their friend is up game' to get more "ME ME" time - you will not see anyone up twice either before or after you in my rotations.  1 time per round per person including duets - this would be the only exception if the duet was with a singer before with a partner that was after you, but that would be considered both persons turn & the partner would not sing their solo song after you in that round.

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The kjs here all allow the singers to sing two songs in a row.  It would be better if they would only allow one song when the rotation is long.  At least I think it would help.  How do most of you handle it.   It's not a matter of getting upset - it's just one of the things in life that i've decided not to put up with - jump rotation on me and i leave.  It's the same as getting bad service and food in a restaurant - once and I don't go back.

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Singing just for you

Rarely will do the 2fer.  Unless it's really dead, I may give the option, but I have found that most singers don't care for the 2fer - in my experience, sure there are some that do, but the majority no.  Your wait time is automatically going to double, if you have 15 singers (you are number 15), that's about an hour right there just doing a solo song, now they are singing 2 songs at a time, that's almost a 2 hour wait before you get to sing your first song.
I have seen some do it until a certain time, which kind of isn't fair either as they take the 2fers, then can only get half as many singers up as their stage time is now doubled, then when their turn does come up the kj tells them they can only do 1 of them & they waited all the extra time to do their 2nd one as well, all in the while getting to the place and turning in their slips pretty much at the same time as everyone else.

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I'm not sure if anyone does this, certainly not the host i was talking about in my original post. Lonman, you system is basically how i have been running my show as well. I make it known, that i don't care who is up next, if a singer has been waiting and hasn't sang yet, and you have been up. He IS next. It's only the fair thing to do. I sure enjoy all of your idea's. And how you run your shows, it give's me an insight as to how others are doing things. Thank you all so very much for your idea's and input. I try to stay consistent. I have some of the older fella's that live all week for friday night, and their 3 minutes of fame. But that's what it's all about i guess. I have had people come up and even ask to see my rotation list. I very politly tell them, when they are up, and who they follow. If some of you were asked to see your rotation list, would you show it to a patron of your club? just curious.

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to me what's fair is the "sheet" method.

On a whiteboard or chalk board, it's very apparant to see how it works.

Sing one, and after your done, if you want to sing again, sign up after everyone else's names. What most call the "line method". Imagine an imaginary line that people are waiting to sing. "Next"... "Next"...

It may not SEEM fair to have to go to the end of the line, but that's the way it is in most areas of life. First come, first served.

That's why I don't consider it that much of a rotation as a sheer number of singers. If you arrive late, hey, that's the breaks. I'm not going to get special treatment at some place like a pool hall. "Hey, you've played twenty games... this guy has only played one... he's up before you!"

Sheesh!

I've never asked to see a rotation list but I have asked how many singers are ahead of me.  Mainly because sometimes if it's going to be a long wait I may be leaving before my time comes up.  If it's just a little while I'll usually hang around and sing once more but it it's going to be a long wait the I'll go ahead and leave

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Singing just for you

I keep my rotation on a magnetic strip board. When you are on stage you can see how long the rotation is and where you are on it. It works to my benefit for people to see how many singers I have.

As far as having people do 2frs -
They would string me up and have me for dinner if I did that. If you have 30 to 40 people in rotation you'd be crazy to even try.
I can't say I've never done it though. A low crowd of 6 or less and just for 1 round I've done. It is more fun to play scaraoke  than just have them sing more to fill time.

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Another thought -
For me displaying the rotation has been nothing, but a plus. Most people see it and realise how hard my job can be and can respect the fact that yeah there are a lot of people singing besides them. I can't do a chalk board because I have to many singers and honestly I would need a karaoke Kop to watch it, so people didn't mess with it.  LMAO I have had people actually come on stage and try to move themselves up in rotation when I was busy. Naughty naughty

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Matt,

I agree - 1st come first served and then to the back of the line ....If you are a late comer and have been "everywhere" else first and then want to stop in and sing a song 10 mins before shutdown ( after being totally intoxicated) ...FORGETABOUT IT !

Babs...I use to list my rotations on a dry erase board when it was busier and it really helped !

The latecomers aren't always a bar hopper drinking everywhere else.  People do work late (at least here they do), they should be penalized because of the job they have that don't allow them to come in earlier?

Karaoke should give everyone a chance to sing within reason.  The people that get there early will still sing more than everyone else.  The latecomer may only get 1 song to everyone elses 3 or 4 but at least they got 1 in.  And again, come in too late, you don't sing at all.

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Lonnie We have 2 singers in rotation Joe & Sue First time Joe sings single.. Sue wants Joe to sing with her.   (duet) allowed...Next time Joe wants Sue as duet.. allowed Sues turn She wants Joe as duet (it is her turn) allowed  No singer is allowed in a rotation in a duet more than once.. Is this your potocol?

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The way I do rotation which is similiar to Lon sometimes can be hard to explain. Believe me the first thing I think about is trying to be fair. When I have more people in rotation the new people have to wait longer to get their first song in, but I don't put them at the end. Sometimes it is pretty close to the end though. Like you all say it isn't fair for the people who've been waiting.
At the end of the night people usually start to filter out, so it isn't that hard to fit in a new person and everyone still gets their turn in. I put them at the end and if there is enough time they'll sing. Once in a while though if a new person comes in at the end of the night they don't get to sing because it wouldn't be fair to the people who have waited an hour. So for me it is more commom sense of where to place people and be fair.

Ex: Beginning of the night 8 singers. As new people come in I'll add the to the end of rotation until I get to the end. Maybe I'll end up with 12.

Then I start at the beginning of the rotation. Now that the rotation has had it's first round people who come in start maybe 5 down, but I stagger new, old, new, old. I may get 1 to 3 new people a round.

As the rotation grows large I'll start new people farther down the line depending on how many I get at once.

Then as people start leaving and the rotation grows smaller I will revert backwards to how I started. Once you have a spot in rotation you stay there. Everyone only gets one turn a round!

Gosh I hope that made sense.

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I MIGHT let it slide the first time if they were new if they didn't know our rules, I will explain the rule after they are done, but in the second round Joe wants Sue to sing, I make sure they BOTH know this will be their turn for that round, Sue won't have a solo spot for that round.  If they want to do the other duet for their next song, then I will stick it back into Joes pile.  Duets count as both persons turn in my rounds.  Most of our customers are fine with this as a matter of fact MANY appreciate it as when I get a duet handed in, often times the other partner doesn't know & DOES NOT want to sing it.

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There are SOME of those -- I do have one regular who comes in later EVERY Saturday due to the fact that she has teenagers home and her and her husband don't get out at 9PM. -- This person I DO ....put right in within reason.

But I dispise the drunks who come in well after you've called. "last call for slips" and give me a hard time because they can't sing a song after I'm already on MY TIME.

Gotta love rotation discussions- usually very informative, and no one ends up flaming anyone. At least so far....

I use a system similar to Babs. I usually wait till I have 8-12 slips in before calling it a round. Then I will work the new singers in as old/new/old/new, etc...

Down here, the 2 song set is pretty standard, and waits approach 90-120 minutes aon a regular night. When that happens I will cut the old singer to one, and still let the new singer do 2. If I have in over 25 slips, then everyone is on song. I keep track of order by holding the slips on my mixer. Unfortunately, it allows some pretty childish behavior, like people putting their slip next, or trying to knock the slips out of my hand to see if I lose the order. Or my all time favorite, ask the host where your slip is and then tell him why you deserve to be next, grab your slip, and stick it back in the hosts hand!

AAAARRRRGGGHHH............

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