Karaoke Forums

I have been at my current gig for just under three years now. My bar owner is a reputed serial dater (to put it nicely). His latest fling is one of my regular singers who I have known for about 5 years from back when I was frequenting karaoke bars as a singer.

This chick is the kind that I hate the most. She thinks she is so much better than everybody and thinks she is entitled to more priveledges than everyone else just because she is a good singer. I would rather have 10 tone-deaf, rhythm challanged singers in a row than her. But she has always come to my show and I have always put up with her BS, while not letting her have any special treatment like she thinks she should be getting.

ANYWAY, about a month ago, my bar owner started dating this chick. That is a pain in the azz in itself, because now when she wants something from me she basically tattles on me to him when I say no. Now he is cool about it, and doesn't force me to do anything, and several times I have told him no and he was cool with that, but still, being my boss I sometimes feel obligated. But that isn't even the problem!!

Last Wednesday, this girl told me that she has secured herself a gig to be a karaoke host. Now, mind you, this girl owns ZERO equipment, ZERO discs, and knows absolutely nothing about running a PA system. Likewise, I think her attitude of entitlement will make her an absolutely horrible KJ. I think humility is pretty important for someone dealing with drunks all night long.

Anyway, so she, and my bar owner, have asked me to help her pick out equipment and discs and teach her how to use it!! I told her that I didn't have time to teach her everything about running a PA system, but would give her a quick crash course. I got as far as explaining that each channel strip on the mixer controlled one source imput and she stopped me and said she didn't get it. I was already frustrated and told her that if she couldn't grasp even the basic concepts that I wasn't going to be able to teach her anything.

SO, after that my bar owner has again asked me to help her out with selecting equipment and discs and showing her how to use it.

I'm not concerned about her taking my gig or anything. I actually firmly believe that this is going to be a major major failure for her. What I am afraid of is that I

#1: don't want to piss off my bar owner by not giving some sort of minimal effort to his request.

#2: I don't have the time, patience, or inclination to hold this girl's hand and teach her everything about everything about being a KJ, which is what she seems to expect from me. ESPECIALLY when there is absolutely nothing in it for me except the chance that I have one more competitor out there.

It is a tough situation!! The only thing that even makes me want to give it any effort is that I know she thinks being a KJ is easy, and I almost think it is worth it to get her to her first show just to see her fall flat on her face. Is that so wrong??

_________________
C Mc
KJ, FL

From experience.. Watch your cd's They will copy  your music copy onto a hard drive try to build a system like yours and next thing you know you are out in the cold.  I
would be looking for another gig ...

It happened to us The regular day and night crowd that patronized this bar for years dont even go there anymore. It might not be that extreme in your case but I wouldnt give them the time of day...BYE....

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Give her reading assignments:
         
     http://www.mackie.com/support/compactmixer/index.html
     http://tinyurl.com/279lfu

Then tell her when she understands those things, you can start showing her how to hook up her system -- once she buys it. If she asks what to buy, give her a list of what you have.

It seems that you have a pretty good working relationship with the bar owner.  However I am somewhat surprised that anyone could 'secure' a karaoke gig with no equipment and no knowledge of how to operate a PA system and it does make me wonder if she has been sweet-talking the bar owner into letting her take over your gig.  You have already attempted once to teach her how to use a mixer and she failed to grasp the concept.  Perhaps you could talk to the bar owner truthfully about the fact that this woman is going to have a very hard time learning to operate the equipment and your knowing that she will most likely fail miserably in running a gig.  You could even embellish it with telling how many years it took you to get your 'degree' in PA equipment!  Maybe you might want to do this after another attemp at training her.  It might just make the owner realise she is not cut out to do this and he may just talk her out of it to save her the fall.

Yep, it sure sounds like the gig she has secured is yours.  Who else in their right brain would hire her without equipment and music?  If you want to save your gig take the bar owner aside out of her hearing and tell him the truth, she's too stupid to be a KJ.

_________________
Okay, who took my pants?

Yep, it sure sounds like the gig she has secured is yours.  Who else in their right brain would hire her without equipment and music?  If you want to save your gig take the bar owner aside out of her hearing and tell him the truth, she's too stupid to be a KJ.

_________________
Okay, who took my pants?

TopherM

I'm sorry you're in this predicament and I concur with those who believe the gig that she will be taking over is your.

Question:  Does it appear that she even has the money to purchase a rig and the music catalog?

If not, my guess is that she has convinced her bar owner/boy friend that he should invest in and control the karaoke equipment and that she is capable of running the show as his first karaoke employee!

So, why not ask her (or him) two questions:
 - where is the venue that would hire her
 - why would the venue do so when she lacks equipment, experience and a catalog of music, while there is no absence of competition that have all of those assets?

Now considering the off-chance possibility there is such a venue, how long REALISTICALLY would it take a moron to purchase everything needed, practice using the gear and setting it up, and "rehearse" running the show to the point that she might pull it off?  Three months at least? Probably more like six?  So, again, where's the venue that has hired her but is in no hurry for her to start?

Lastly, what makes the bar owner think that you should train this girl for nothing? Refer her to Big Dog's (who was just banned again elsewhere) school which costs $5,000 and worth every penny of it according to BD.  He'll train her on everything, including selection of the equipment!

TopherM, it wouldn't hurt to put out feelers to find another venue.  If nothing else, this woman/girl is going to drive you crazy as long as you're still there and she's still the girlfriend.  


Best of luck

Eric

A little more background...I know for sure it is another bar that is offering her the job. This other bar used to have karaoke but have not had it for about 6-8 months now. I honestly think she BSed her way into getting the job offer at this other bar.

Honestly, I did the same exact thing when I first started out, telling the guy that gave me my first job that I had all the equipment and a few years of experience when I certainly did not then just having everything ready to go by our agreed start date. I think that is exactly what she is doing. Of course, I already had previously played in a few local bands and knew my way around a PA system and mixer, so once I actually had all of the equipment, running it wasn't a new thing.

And I know my bar owner is smarter than trying to replace me with her. He has a new "girlfriend" about every 2-3 months (i.e., f*** buddy...), he certainly isn't all of the sudden committing to letting this chick take over the gig I've been running very successfully for the last three years. The bar owner and I do have a pretty good relationship and he knows as well as anyone else that this girl will only be around until someone younger or prettier comes along. He hates her even coming to the bar as a patron as is, basically because that is his flirting grounds, so he isn't going to voluntarily make her a regular fixture.

I also question if she can even afford to purchase the equipment and music. Honestly, the way this bar she is talking to is NOTORIOUS for going through KJs, it could possibly be a horrible investment to purchase all of that stuff just for that gig. The owner of this other bar is one of those guys who thinks the KJ should fill his bar to capasity every night, and frankly his bar sucks so no one is ever going to be able to fill it. Like I said, they have not had karaoke for about 6-8 months now, but even when they did, he went through about 4-5 KJs a year, including a few friends of mine who I know are very good KJs.

Of course, I have three karaoke rigs and wouldn't be adverse to selling her one of them It was my first rig from back in the day that is fine for a bar the size of what she is talking about, but wouldn't come anywhere close to being adequate in my bar. Yamaha Mixing amp, 270 watt 15" speakers, etc.. Again, I would almost guarantee that this girl is REALLY going to suck at being a KJ, so I'm not particularly worried about her being competition and may as well make some profit out of the deal if my owner wants me to help her out as a favor anyway.

_________________
C Mc
KJ, FL

I am going to take a Devils Advocate position here for a minute...

While I agree the venue is most likely the same as where you are, I think it is probably for a differrent night. I would point her in the right direction for a pre assembled/idiot proof system like a Passport (no offense Eric), and some basic CD's.

I have a friend that for years b**ched about every host and how they screwed him, etc. He got hired to work a house system a few months ago. Since then he has a new respect for me and other hosts- it also cured him of wanting to host ever again!

But here's my silver lining....If you reccomend a decent system and libranry, and she tries it, and as you think she will, falls flat on her face, what do you think will happen to that equipment? Chances are the boyfriend/manager/ financier will have no use for it, and since you were so nice to help her, maybe he'll offer it to you for a discount, and you just got a new backup system.....

_________________
Let's Kick the Tires and Light the Fires!

Listen if she wants to waste her money, let her.  Recommend players, amps, speakers, and disc brands to use.  Tell her that purchases are of a personal nature (some like Mackie, Peavey, Yorkville, etc), but all are of a professional quality.  Once she realizes the investment required, she may say no way.  If she spends the bucks, then she has to make it on her own.  Good equipment and good music do not make the host.  She will rise or fall on her own merits.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

i say find out what kinda guy she likes and find her a new b/f,  but no matter how bad she is i don't think anyone deserves investing alotta money just to see it thrown away, she may very well need the money but feels she honestly can make a go of it....i  would help her as much as i could r bear and constantly be warning her of the very good chance of it not working out and her losing all the money she invested in it.....odds r u won't talk her out of it but you tried.....but to let her invest and to know that she will fail at it and NOT warn her r help her would in my opinion make u worse than she is.....if she's not taking ur job then what  have u got to lose?  other than time....plus i'm betting if she were a nice girl and u were single u would be more than willing to help her out..... but what do i know....JMO

I have to ditto this one, but do it in somewhat a develish way.  Tell her to get the most EXPENSIVE stuff out there.  She will have sticker shock and run the oter way.

You are kinda screwed if you do screwed if ya dont. If you do not help then you are vindicating every complaint she has taken to her b/f in the past. So if in your shoes I would be helping with a good grace to disprove that.
2nd if you do help and she does end up taking over your position you have shot yourself in the foot.
But by having been the gentleman about it, when the bar owner moves to the next lady you are likely to be the first person he phones.
Like I said, damned if you do, damned if you dont

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

Has it ever occured to you that you are being asked TO TRAIN YOUR REPLACMENT.

This is a real Catch -22. Here's why: She will go out and fail. Miserable. Then guess who will get the blame for TRAINING HER POORLY! YOU!!

The best advice you could possibly give her is to first for a year or two go out and find a KJ job working for someone as a house system KJ completly indendent of your bar. Then she will really begin to LEARN what KJing is about NIGHT AFTER NIGHT. With all the drunks, the whiners, the complainers, the bitchy waitresses, the crabby bar owners and KJ Boss constantly correcting her.

YOU MUST MAKE CLEAR that KJing is not something you just jump into.

AND THAT YOU WILL NOT HAVE TIME TO PROPERLY TRAIN HER and DO YOUR SHOWS TOO.  Tell them that for you to give her a cursory heres how you do it---would be a GRAVE INJUSTICE TO HER.

AND THEN TELL THEM YOUR NOT AVAILABLE TO TRAIN, COACH, SUPERVISE and DIRECT HER.

Tell them the best advice you can possibly give is for her to go out and learn it the hardway---IN THE TRENCHES--THE REAL WORLD WAY--She needs to get out and pound the pavement and find her own gig and learn it the way all the others did.
ASK HIM did he learn to run a bar this way or did he have to learn it the hard way???
KJing is NO DIFFERENT!

Or ........................YOU CAN SAY.........."YES SURE I'd be GLAD TO TRAIN HER AS MY REPLACEMENT!!" ............cuase u know what----thats exactly what they are asking you to do.

You need to be firm and clear with him. If he doenst like what you tell him then you need to start looking for another gig.

The Sticker shock angle is good too. Let her know shes going to need 5K in equipment sound gear and lighiting, another 5K in music. Several hundred to make songbooks(program & pritning) & songlslips, business cards, etc etc. She will need a large vehicle to haul it all. Will need to INSURE  all the equipment and INJURY/LIABILTY INSURANCE(VERY EXPENSIVE), an advertising budget-a few hundred a month, Monthly song updates and songbook revisions. Then she will need to invest the TIME TO PROPERLY LEARN to mix, run a rotation, operate lighting. And she will need to get a BUSINESS LISCNECE and a buisness tax ID. EXPLAIN WHAT SHES WANTING TO DO IS START A BUSINESS--and your not really qualified to tell her how to start or run her business.

The ENTIRE IDEA/CONCEPT IS SIMPLY LUDICRIS!!

_________________
"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

Been there done that... 5 years fri sat sun... Up to $175/night.. Once burned twice shy Dont ever become allegient to a bar owner unless you have a written contract and BTW pay your dues and local minimal taxes for each gig. Register your business with city or county and be legal..

You might be amazed how many here are giving legal advice and not even a legal business. or paying taxes...Yet they want to tell everybody in the world how illegal they are..

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Been there done that... 5 years fri sat sun... Up to $175/night.. Once burned twice shy Dont ever become allegient to a bar owner unless you have a written contract and BTW pay your dues and local minimal taxes for each gig. Register your business with city or county and be legal..

You might be amazed how many here are giving legal advice and not even a legal business. or paying taxes...Yet they want to tell everybody in the world how illegal they are..

_________________
Join The Karaokle Singers Social Network. Upload Your Music!!

Ollie, you are probably correct. I am a limited liability company which up till this last financial year has run at a loss, looks like I shall be paying this year for sure, I have run out of stuff to replace since I did a total replacement last year.
Ah well at least I can sleep I guess...what am I talking about...I never sleep  :shock:

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."

That's 'cause you try to sleep at night, and everyone knows that Kiwis are nocturnal creatures!  :wave:

I'd ask the bar owner if he would be willing to train somebody who was planning to open a bar across the street.  Then tell him that you're not willing to train your competition either.  

Unless the bar owner is completely irrational, he shouldn't be offended or make a big deal out of it.  Just because somebody asks us to do something doesn't mean we're obligated to say yes.  And as a business owner, I think it would downright stupid for you to say anything but a polite HELL NO!

 :hug: sweetheart I would say c'mere n snog me but I will get told off for flirting so take it as read ok?

_________________
"Be who you are and say what you feel... Because those that matter... Don't mind...And those that mind... Don't matter."