Karaoke Forums

First, I want to point out that I don't know of anyone on this website who does this. Sorry to sound so negative.

Karaoke is very popular in my area. There are a lot of people who sing really well and who enjoy singing. Why do so many of the KJs here still play up to three minutes of music between every song? How do these people justify keeping their jobs? With a rotation of more than ten minutes between tunes they wish to play most of a filler song and sing every round too.

If we packed into the clubs where only the good KJs did shows we would only get to sing once or twice a night. This doesn't work for me. The good Jocks get plenty of support from their current clients, they don't need me there. This is one reason I am retraining myself here before I get back into to the market. I respect the singers too much to offer them such crappy service. When I feel that I'm ready I will be looking to replace the few that suck with my own show.

The two best KJs I have ever known are best friends of mine. One can make a whole crowd do anything he wants them to, charisma and attention to the customer's interests. The other creates a singing evironment that is the best I have ever heard, clear crisp sound that compliments each singer individually. We have too many jocks here that mope through the shows, use the same mixer settings for every song and couldn't care less what the crowd wants in a show.

The jocks here that draw the big crowds are the few good KJs in our area. Because of the state of karaoke in our area, I can't stand going out to clubs right now. This is a topic I have been sitting on for some time now but I feel that it is a legitimate complaint. I wish there was a circuit that would allow people from this site to come to town and host some shows to prove to the area hacks how it can be done right.

I don't do this, but my ex-partner Dave did.

The reason the bar gave him is that the bar is filled with 150-200 people, only of which 10-40 people are enjoying karaoke. Therefore, play something that pleases everyone.

The fault to this arguement is that you can't please everyone. Period. Heck, Pres. Lincoln used to talk about that! ! It's NOT just 10-40 people, but also, those singer's FRIENDS, and sometimes, yes, it's hard to believe, sometimes people come in TO watch the singers, and maybe, just maybe, want to do it themselves.

I hung out at a karaoke place for MONTHS before working up the nerve (and being quite drunk helped) to do karaoke. What finally moved me up there was there were some absolutely horrid singers that night, and I KNEW that I'd be better than THEY were... well, I almost was...

Anyway, the point to all this is, chances are, the KJ has been told by the venue to play "more than JUST karaoke"...

Chuck... ASK them the next time you go in. Flat out ask the manager!

Good idea. I know one place where the owner has pretty much tied the KJ's hands as to how to run the show.

the problem is, when that happens, you end up with a mediocre show. Never truly pleasing ANY crowd.

The karaokers hate it, because of the waiting, and the seriously long rotations.

The bar folks hate it, because of the danged singers ruining good songs.

the dancers hate it because nobody can make up their minds!!

What I always tell the venue that wants it I MIGHT agree to a DANCE SET, say every two hours and have a 15-30 min dance set, but it'll be in the open for everyone to see, and the customers will know this was requested of me... that it's NOT something I normally do.

I always crack up when a venue wants karaoke, and then they want to destroy how it works by telling you how they want it DONE. I usually let them tell me, and then I tell them how I'LL do it, and if they don't like it, then find someone else that will do it.

I'm pretty flexible, but I'm also very vocal about what I think will happen!

Have I been proven wrong?? Well, my ex-partner is STILL at that one club where they do a full dance song after every singer! And he gets tons of complaints every night... for nearly five years this has been going on! And he tells the complainers, talk to the barstaff, who flat out tell the complainers that if they don't like THEIR BAR's format, go to another place. Strange how the complainers honestly don't vote with their feet!!?? They usually sit and mutter, and want real karaoke around them. However when faced with another option, they'll instead want to sit where all their friends are!

Exactly why bad karaoke shows exist, singers don't really care, they just whine about it & accept it!

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Failure is probably the best teacher of anything.  IF, the person who fails is smart enough to realize why, AND, if they make changes.  Too many "bad" KJ's are allowed to continue either because the patrons could care less or the bar owner could care less as long as the money comes in.

Personnaly, I have never worked as a KJ anywhere that I am not allowed to call the shots.  That's an agreement I make up front even before we would discuss money.  I tell them that I don't bartend so I won't try and tell them how to run it.  And obviously they don't KJ or they wouldn't be wanting to hire me.  

Our bar get's a diverse crowd.  They have two other KJ who work different nights then I do.  One is just about 90% country.  One is in to more Hard rock and rap.  Me?  I have probably the most diverse.  Rock to old, old country.  My nights are more popular due to sound, selection and service.  I don't play filler music.  Some do but not me.  They hired me to do karaoke, not DJ.  If people want to hear a DJ, they can come on the nights the club DJ,s.  On my night, they are going to hear karaoke.  No Rap.  I'm sorry but one I don't buy it and two, I personnally don't classify it as music.  AND, my crowd feels pretty much the same way.  If they want to hear crap, er,... I mean rap, they can come on one of the other nights.

Kelly

My show thrives on about 75% karaoke and about 25% dance music. I work in one of those bars where it is a young crowd, about 21-26 on average, and I feel it is my job to entertain the WHOLE bar and not just the karaoke singers. On any given Saturday, there are 150-200 people in the bar and about 20-30 singers. Any given singer that shows up when I start at 9:00 is going to get to sing about 4 times if they stay the whole night, and many do.

In between singers, I play about 30-45 seconds of dance music. If the dance floor fills up, I let it roll about 2 minutes, which happens about 6-8 songs a night. Even the singers say that they are glad there is some excitement while they are waiting for thier song to come up. My 1-1.5 hour rotation would be like 45 min - 1 hour if I skipped on the filler music, but 90% of the crowd would rather wait the extra 15 minutes and be entertained when they are not singing instead of getting up 1-2 more times a night.

Here is the everlasting cycle of karaoke:

A good KJ starts at a new bar. He/she soon gets a nice base of regulars. These regulars come in because the karaoke night is pretty slow and they get to sing 6-8 times a night with a good KJ. Soon the show gets more and more popular and soon they only get to sing 2-3 times a night, so they stop being regulars and go to another bar where they can sing 6-8 times a night. The karaoke night slows down because some of the regulars left, and new regulars take their place to start the whole cycle over again.

At my bar, this cycle seems to repeat itself about every 3-4 months.

The "loyal" regulars that come in for karaoke only and want to sing as many times as possible will abandon you and drop you THE SECOND your show becomes popular. You know what, though? The ones that come in for the good dance music keep right on coming!! I have regulars that have been showing up every Saturday for 2 years just for my filler music. They understand that in most cases I am only going to play 30-45 seconds of a song, but that energy stays high all night, even if the karaoke singers sing 3-4 ballads in a row.

And say what you will, but I have a very attractive female clientale that come to shake their a** weekly, and where there are girls dancing, the guys follow. My job is to fill that bar with people NOT to make sure everyone gets to sing a certain number of times, and I do my job week in and week out.

SO, I guess what I am saying is that your generalizations are not universally true. Sure, many KJs may abuse the filler and not know what they are doing as far as reading a crowd, but there are also some of us that integrate it flawlessly and create a really good product that is MORE than just karaoke, and as long as my show is putting 200 butts in the seats, it is better than any show putting 50 butts in the seats where you get to sing 8 times a night BY A LONGSHOT.

If you want to see it done right, come on down to FL one Saturday and I'll change your mind!!

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C Mc
KJ, FL

You're right.  It ain't the same everywhere.  And I do agree, intertainment is the whole thing, but karaoke can be THE entertainment.  I don't have the cycle you do.  I been at the same place for 5 years.  Apparanetly I'm blessed.  I have probably about 25 good regulars who have been with me almost that long also.  The majority of the non singing crowd comes to dance and HEAR our singers.  That's what they tell me.  Yes, some night the regulars don't get to sing much.  But they still come here because , better sound, and better crowd appreciation.  What I do obviously wouldn't work where you're at, and what you do wouldn't set well with our folks.

There's too many DJ places that one could go to in this city if that's what they want.  Nights when I'm there is known for good karaoke.  That's why it's been successful.

It is interesting though how much different, different parts of the country are.

Kelly

Sorry Topher, I didn't mean to sound so broad in my description above. One point I can think of narrowing down is the fact that the jocks I am speaking of don't have any dancers up dancing when they are playing this filler music. Another is the fact they are often on the phone when this happens. There is only one that I know of in my area who is a member of this website. I referred him. I wish they were all on this site.

It is hard to know how specific to be to get the point accross without making the OP top-heavy. Sorry for the confusion. I will be glad to clarify any more issues.

Actually, of the two jocks from this area that I personally know are members here, neither are currently doing karaoke.

Chuck2, I know it would probably be hard to do, but "just don't go."  Things in a bar such as you describe won't change unless the money changes.  Find a KJ that most of you can agree on.  Get him in somewhere; then stick with him.  And if he get's offered another place go again.

The bad KJ keeps his job, simply beacuse the patrons allow him to do so.  Find a good KJ and get behind him.

Kelly

Playing filler or dance music in between singers does not make for a BAD KJ.
If they are playing a dance set because they are lazy or ignoring singers and as you said too  busy talking on their celll.....Then thats a bad KJ.

I have always maintained the following:

If it is "karaoke night" and you do not play any filler music you may get 54 songs in a night..TOPS for 4 hours.  Now do the math

If you have 15 singers -  3.6 songs each --Great ratio for the singers some will get 4 songs others 3.

If you have 20 singers - 2.7 songes each - still not bad 3 songs and some will get 2

If you have 25 singers - Most singers will get 2 songs a night ---Not too good for the SINGERS but GREAT for the BAR

Point being that if your show is very succesfull and you get 30+ singers each night
That maybe only 1 song for some?  My experiance tells me that most singers find that insufficient  time and they will "prefer" a bar with filler music where they can sing 3 or 4 songs . Of course there are exceptions and if you have a great crowd that  really gets along then they will prefer the feindships over the 1 or 2 extra songs.

The secret to a GREAT KJ ...Is making the singers forget they are waiting to sing because they are too busy having a great time with everyone else singing.

Still searching for  the answer

'Know what I hate?  I went someplace where they didn't have a particular song I wanted to sing for karaoke ("Black Horse and the Cherry Tree"-KT Tunstall), BUT THEY HAD IT FOR FILLER MUSIC!!!!  That was really frustrating, and I know the song IS available for karaoke because I've sung it before!  Has that ever happened to any of you?

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I love being a mom!

Agree!  And I never meant to imply that a KJ is bad because he or she plays filler music.  We each do what works for us AND the club.  I do have to say though that with karaoke being done digitally rather than with discs, will provide quite a bit more than 54 songs a night.  It's been a while since i counted but I may have to do that soon and see how the numbers stack up.

Kelly

I guess I am still trying to find out how to approach the situation and who to pose the question to.

If I only get to sing two or three times a night and I don't realize it then it means that I had a good time and didn't notice. These days it is not safe to stay at the club long enough to sing more than once, maybe twice. The TABC saw to that a short time ago.

yeah, well the "Texas Alcohol Beverage Commission" also fights hand in hand with the law that states you can drive down the street with an open beer, too!

Talk about a weird state to live in!

Chuck, I will say that maybe if you had described the situation a bit more clearly, we wouldn't have both camps interest here. I'm certain that Topher and other Jocks that mix in reg music and their venues love them for it don't like to be lumped in with the lazy suckers you're describing that could give two craps for anybody but their pocketbook.

Unfortunately, our business WILL bring in the shyksters that think they can drink all night for free and make a few bucks in the process... and you know, until the singers vote with their mouths (i.e. tell management why they're leaving and not coming back) as well as their feet, these types of folks will be there.

Oh, let's not forget the idiot bar managers/owners that THINK of those types "as just karaoke" rather than hunting down a quality show.

That is a great distinction that yall made....if the rotation IS long, then the KJ should provide enough interaction and entertainment that those waiting don't notice that they are waiting. That is one of the great things about my bar, and why the filler music works for me. Everyone is energized and into the show whether they are singing or not. I totally agree that it wouldn't work in about 75% of the other bars that do karaoke in my area, even if it was me trying to pull it off. My show is tailored to my audience, and not the other way around. Some KJs don't get that and run the same show night after night without allowing it to evolve nightly and even hourly with their audience. I fill in for a guy sometimes at this local country sh*t kicker bar and there is NO WAY IN HELL my show even resembles the one I put on at my regular bar. Yet many KJs WOULD put on the same show, and that makes them REALLY suck.

The other thing I HATE as a singer is when the KJ plays filler music that are also popular karaoke songs. One place I go to on Thursdays the guy plays the same songs that some of the regulars sing, so you end up not only hearing them twice BUT you usually are more cognizant of the fact that the amateur singer is really bad compared to the original artist!

Oh, and just one more thing. I have said this before and I'll say it again. 95% of the KJs on this board are on here BECAUSE they legitmately care about the quality of their show, so you won't find many KJs on this site that are not doing things right out there

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C Mc
KJ, FL

Amen Brother TopherM, amen!

Kelly

So true. I wish more of you folks lived here.

Kelly even being computerized you are not going to get many more songs sung in a 4 hours period.  If you consider an average song maybe 4 minutes plus another
15-20 seconds for singers to get to the mic and your almost at 4-1/2 minutes per singer AVERAGE.  4.5mins x 54 = 243 minutes (4 hrs 3 minutes)

I guess if all songs were 3minutes and everyone was standing at the ready maybe
60 songs...but we know thats not the case.

One thing I can say since going computerized is that "granted its a lot easier" to load songs up , I don't think it is  that much faster overall.  Before I would have the triple tray all loaded up and BINGO next singer just as quick as my PC. --I mean you still have to wait at least a few seconds for the singer --so YES the pc loads quicker ..But my show isn't any quicker. iif thats makes sense  lol