Karaoke Forums

Greeting to all... I am new here, really need your input to complete my karaoke system. Here is what I use for my living room setup

1. Yamaha MG8/2FX mixer, has +4dBu main output level
2. M-Audio BX8A active monitor, with Monster TRS balanced cable
3. Pioneer DVD karaoke player with key control
4. Sennheiser E845S mic, with Mogami Gold Quad cable

I know most of you have a passive PA system, and I only have a small active monitor setup. But far I am quite happy in term of the "look" and overall performance for small karaoke and Hi-fi playback. The very next I am planning to do is adding a BBE sonix maximizer, but I need some advice from you guys regarding each of this

1. BBE 482i - use latest DSP. It has unbalanced input/output but is it going to hurt since I have a balanced setup so far. Beside, I believe it has -10dBu input/output level, instead of +4dBu. But I really not sure if that really matter. Any comment?

2. BBE 882i - Would be perfect if using this unit; latest DSP, +4dBu balanced input/output. I would definitely getting this one if it is within my budget range. But just wondering, do I really need the +4dBu balanecd input/output? I am not doing any recording.

3. BBE Maxcom - look like similar to 882i but has the extra compressor/limiter/gate... It costs less than the 882i and I am not sure why and what is missing compared to the 882i. But does anyone own this stuff?

Any comment is welcome. Thanks!

Well you really don't need the 'lates & greatest' when it comes to the BBE.  The technology hasn't changed all the much since they came out - maybe a slightly cleaner sound, but not by alot.  I run an oler 422A & a newer 482 & there is very little (if any) difference in sound quality.
As far as balanced vs unbalanced - if the rest of your system is balanced, then it is a good idea to stay with that, no reason to unbalance for 1 processor.  Go to ebay & pick up an older 800 series unit.

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Yea I run the older 362.  It is -10 dbu in I have a modified mixer where the 362 (and aphex) is in series out and then back in just before the main faders. I usually run the channels about -3db and the mic channels close to unity.  This seems to give a good level to the 362. Then I can adjust the over all volume.

Lon on your Dbx 266xl do you run the input at -10 or 4 I seem to have feedback probs at -10 and run mine at 4 But this is inserting out of a dfx12 and I never did like the gain on the preamps...

I honestly don't remember, it's been over 2 years since i've hooked it up.  I believe it's set at +4.

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should I be looking at this type of a maximizer Lon?  can it be had off ebay for decent price?  thnks - your protege.  LMAO

You can get a good BBE off of ebay for under $50 usually.  Yes if you can find one from there go for it, it would help the system outlined for you.

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Thanks for your input Lon. Based on your experience, is the limiter/compressor/gate really useful for karaoke? How do you combat microphone feedback?

Some said good mic with good feedback rejection is the way. But too bad the Beta 58, 86 doesn't have the on/off switch. That's why have to pick the e845s so in case if feedback still occur I can turn it off quickly. Any better way without having to spend lots of money?

I would never run a microphone without a compressor at minimum - a limiter is an added bonus.  A gate is not needed.  How I combat feedback, properly placed speakers & a good dual 31 band eq for the mains & a single 31 band eq for the monitor with an independant mix for the monitor from the mains.

On/off switch isn't needed in karaoke either - if your mixer is equipped with mute buttons, that's your on/off switch.  Or just pull the fader down.  A switch isn't going to stop feedback, it's where the mic is in correlation to where the speakers are is what will stop it.  Get your speakers out in front of the singer aiming out to the crowd.  Then if you still get feedback, you need to turn down the system.  If you find that you need to turn the system up to near max all the time, then you may need to upgrade to a higher wattage amp & stronger speakers.

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too bad my mixer doesn't have the mute button, nor I have that kind of budget to afford EQ you said since this is only for home use. so I guess will stick with on/off switch mic for a while and better off focusing on stuff like the BBE sonix maximer at the time being...

interest enought after browse thru the BBE Maxcom manual it said it can be used to suppress feedback without EQ. perhaps that should be a cheap alternative to protect my speaker... will do more research on that...

Well what do you consider out of budget?  http://cgi.ebay.com/DBX-231-2-CH-TWO-DUAL-CHANNEL-31-BAND-EQ-EQUALIzER-NIB_W0QQitemZ180012223884QQihZ008QQcategoryZ23788QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem  Is the one I use & this is actually cheaper than what I paid.  About the same price as the MaxCom.  
I would still consider a compressor for your mics however.

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wow... not bad for the price. thanks for the link!

so to combat feedback with EQ, do you have to change the EQ setting for every song and different mic? Or once it is tuned up it will stay permanent?

Once I have it dialed in for the club, I don't have to make any adjustments to the actual eq, I make adjustments on the mixer.

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There are a bunch of them on Ebay.  And they aren't too 'spensive.  Seems like the 462 might be the best bang for your buck option, and BBE still makes processing chips for them (462 and 422).  What is so different from the 4 series than the 3 and 2 series?  I did find one 422 for 69 bucks at another website.  Is this the one you run Lon (422 diferent from 422a?)?  should I grab the 422 or get a 462?

I actually have the 422A.  I prefer it over the newer models because it shows on the LED's what frequencies it's working on.  The newer models just have an LED level meter.  But really not that big of a deal.  If you can find a newer one cheap, then go for it.  But you CAN find & get them for under $50 off of ebay.  I bought 2 of them last year for a friend & 1 I paid $1.65 + $10 shipping (422A) & the other I paid $19 + $8 shipping (462).

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Correct me if I am wrong... after reading a few articles the function of these devices are as follows:

1. Compressor is function like a protection device to regulate input/output signal to protect the downstream equipment, as well as to prevent sound distortion due to signal clipping. so it is a must have device if my application requires loud volume, otherwise it is not really necessary right (since i don't do recording)?

2. Expander on the other hand is used to suppress white noise. These noises are audible at loud volume so again for loud volume application this is a must have device, or not necessary if otherwise.

3. EQ is more useful to combat mic feedback. You don't need this unless there is serious feedback problem.

4. BBE Sonic Maximizer is another unique category since none of the above really "enhance" the sound the like way BBE Sonic Maximizer does... right? So this is a must have device regardless... am I right?

any more categories?

cheers!

Correct me if I am wrong... after reading a few articles the function of these devices are as follows:

1. Compressor is function like a protection device to regulate input/output signal to protect the downstream equipment, as well as to prevent sound distortion due to signal clipping. so it is a must have device if my application requires loud volume, otherwise it is not really necessary right (since i don't do recording)?

2. Expander on the other hand is used to suppress white noise. These noises are audible at loud volume so again for loud volume application this is a must have device, or not necessary if otherwise.

3. EQ is more useful to combat mic feedback. You don't need this unless there is serious feedback problem.

4. BBE Sonic Maximizer is another unique category since none of the above really "enhance" the sound the like way BBE Sonic Maximizer does... right? So this is a must have device regardless... am I right?

any more categories?

cheers!

crap.  they are not going that cheap right now...

In basic terms compression makes the louds quieter and the quiets louder whereas expansion is just the opposite. Peak compression reduces bursts so the overall volume can be increased so the quiets can heard.  The protection stems from the fact these peaks can cause clipping (the peak level exceeds the amps capability and flattens into a dc component) which destroys speaker coils as they have no resistance to dc. The first stage of compression is limiting which is similar to automatic volume control. Compression can be easy or difficult

Expansion is used for eliminating undesired sounds such as breathing It can also be used to put silence at the beginning and ending of a recording.

The equalizer was first designed to compensate for frequecy shortcomings in the old hi-fi systems and tailor the system for human  hearing.It can be used to eliminate feedback It is nothing more than a method to enhance or decrease certain frequencies. I use it extensively on certain singers to cut down certain dominant harmonics to enrich their vocals or to boost their range.

A Sonic Maximizer isn't a must have for any system, it can greatly aid in making a smaller system sound a little bigger.  It's a frequency aligner is basically what it is, it takes the highs/mids/lows and corresponds their wavelenghths together - is essentially what it does.  In the process it also has the ability to brighten the highs & boost the lows.

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