Karaoke Forums

Hi kelly  :wave:
Most of my regulars want me to pick thir songs for them too. I keep their song lists on index cards. It makes it easy to keep the rotation moving quickly, not to mention being able to control the music mood.  :hi5:

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Babs,

I keep their slips for them on a clip.  It's kept in a alphabatized box. They get them when they come in and put them back when they leave.  This also let's them remove or add to their selection.  I thought about the index thing, but that's something I don't have to do.  They have to do something? Right?

Kelly

Entertainer, MC, soundman, public relation expert, bouncer, as an employee a spotter, cheerleader, comedian, 86er, flirter. talent presenter, general announcer,computer xpert, sound tech, psychologist, rule enforcer, set upper, tear downer, hauler, business person, scheduler, an thats just during the first rotation....

I guess I'm too new to this, but it seems to me that a lot of KJs are simply there to collect slips, call names and put on the music.  Entertaining seems to have very little to do with it.  Big Mike is an exception but he's the only one I've seen so far who does that.

I agree with Kap that a KJ can and should set the tone for how the show is run and should try to be as inclusive as possible.  There is probably a limit to how much can be done, though.  For example, if there are a bunch of 50 somethings at the bar and the vast majority of the singers are doing contemporary stuff, I think it's going to be hard for the KJ to get much 60's rock or country in without doing quite a bit of singing.  That seems to be contrary to the opinions that most of the KJs on this forum have.  

The other limitation is that some KJs can't sing or don't sing well.  In my case I think I have a pretty good idea of my limitations.  I sing country, blues and classic rock.  If you want to hear "Mack the Knife" then somebody else will have to do it because I know that I would never be able sell that.  Same goes with contemporary music.  I don't have a feel for it.  It's not that it's good or bad, it's that I'm simply not talented enough to have that kind of flexibility.

Still, I agree that the KJ within reasonable limits, needs to try to get as many people involved as possible, needs to try to get in a slow song once in awhile, or a fast one when things have been slow.  A KJ has to be a host, a faciliatator, and a bridge between singers.  That doesn't necessarily require stand-up comedy or a set of broadway show tunes.  But it does require some presence and personality, natural friendliness and the ability to make people feel comfortable.

Larry

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"Life is too short for diet soda and lite beer"

God I would go nuts just being a robot.  A host must be entertaining to keep the flow going.  That doesn't mean he or she sing every other song or what have you but to keep the atmosphere up, let people know what's going on, interacting, etc.  I've been to many karaokes that had the host go "Sally's up, John's on deck" and what a snoozefest.  If that is what you want, then get a jukebox.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

THAT's where the cream floats to the top.. (or whatever the cliche is)..  I think if there are a BUNCH of 50 somethings at the bar, a clever KJ will not just mingle with a few of them, but get one or two of the tipsy ladies, or older guys that are feeling good up on stage...THAT start's getting EVERYONE having fun... Like Toquer mentioned 6 months back, there ARE times the performer has to go a little beyond the average task of just doing the regular "here I am, you all come to me" routine, "if you don't want to sing, the heck with you". My guess is this is what Bigdog was referring to... Why are you assuming those that aren't singing don't want to sing ?  For all you know, they've been taught they can't sing, so shouldn't sing... they don't sound good...You must teach them what Karaoke is about...EVERYBODY likes to have fun... The KJ has to LIKE people, and get them inspired....Sometime call it "mingling" or even "kissing $#%%"... Other's call it the sign of an excellent entertainer, he must "facilitate" even if it means going up and sitting among a group of elderly folks, and asking them to make a request !  remember some don't take part, because karaoke isn't something THEY really are familiar with, they (like myself) are from the old school and think,  "If I can't sing, I don't belong in front of a microphone"..... Isn't it the job of the KJ to make Karaoke fun for ALL ?  Some are just shy.... They aren't having fun because they don't realize they too are included... The KJ is the recreation director, and music director too.... It's your library, you have something for everybody, but how will the 50+ crowd know they too can have fun if all they hear is Eminem, and Jewel ?  The KJ in certain situations should mingle and extend themselves.... Doncha think ?   It's not the job of the 21 year olds to do that... You ARE recreation director.... Sure your limited in some ways... that's why you do what you do in a :smart: way... OF COURSE you can and should EVEN get the over 50 crowd involved.... Who knows,  they likely think Karaoke is "just for the teenagers" because nobody has ever taught them otherwise !   It's up to the KJ to introduce it to them IMO.... Go the extra yard !   That IMHO is why the KJ MUST be an entertainer.  Some of you sleeping giants are quite likely sitting at the bar watching TV....  They don't think Karaoke is "for them"... They think you are catering to "the kids" because the kids are the only ones turning their slips in... and the over 50 crowd feels out've place.   This is what I like about what Kelly mentioned he does... It's important to show them You are with them, not against one age brackets music..

Incidently this is not an easy thing for many to do... but like I said, I do believe extending yourself to ALL is what the entertainment must do... Some are facing away because they are shy, feel excluded...

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Stephen I don't mean it as an insult... but they are not there to entertain the pool players, drunks (who don't sing) and other patrons. They are there for the people who want to use the service. That is the point I was trying to make. Noone should walk into a bar (when they don't sing) and expect the KJ to be there to make THEM happy. That is all I was trying to say. An "entertainer" is someone who is paid to just sing, dance, make jokes or whatever. A KJ is paid to run the equipment and tend to the people who are singing. That is the difference I was trying to point out. Also I should mention, I prefer a KJ who is willing to try and get the crowd to participate... but people who aren't there for the karaoke shouldn't expect the KJ to do cartwheels for them... am I wrong?

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Te audire no possum. Musa sapientum fixa est in aure. (I can't hear you. I have a banana in my ear.)

I respectfully disagree with what you are saying Lisa, and here's why.



You've already put an obstacle between yourself, and prospective pool players who often will, and DO sing... Sometimes it's subtleties such as a KJ or DJ's attitude "I'm here if you want me, but YOU come up to me", as opposed to the proper attitude, "I get payed to entertain as many as I can, and not present barriers, excluding a group because of my own assumptions" It's easy to give off vibes without even knowing it...

Lisa, in presenting this as you did, you've already distanced yourself from a group that you SHOULD try to also include in your show... Pool players, and drunks are singers too !
You try to consider EVERYBODY at the bar as a prospective customer, singer in this sense.. You have no way of knowing who the singer's are...There might be a reason certain people aren't singing, it might be that they don't feel you've included them...

THE KJ should not be the one to set obstacles...Sometimes, it's small attitudes that do in fact send vibes....Drunks, pool players, old farts watching the ball game DO usually enjoy music EVERYBIT as much as those young ones that grew up in a karaoke world... They just might not think Karaoke is "cool"..OR, they might not think you like, or even HAVE songs that they grew up with and love. They might feel like "old squares". That's how the KJ can make a difference... You present it as being fun for ALL... excluding noone... YOU ARE there to at least promote you, take pride in what you do, and sometimes it means even attempting the "hard sell"....SImply, "power's of positive thinking and attitude"... It matters !!  Surprisingly a DJ, or KJ can sell alot with their musical presentation.  They have alot more control than many give them.. or at least they CAN have more control if they :know how: to work a crowd..

Let me ask you this ?

IF Karaoke is just about being there, putting a disc in at a singer's request, and it doesn't involve talent, (someone good with his/her audience)... WHY are people surprised that the 17 year old nothing (of a talent) is able to undercut most of the KJ's and steal their jobs ?   IF being a KJ just involved putting on music, handing out a microphone in an automated manner.... ANYONE could be a KJ, barely a step up from the CAVS JB-199 jukebox.. It requires more than just knowing where your songs are, and quickly popping them in the machine.. It involves socializing with the crowd, showing an impartial interest in ALL age groups.... and I do believe the good DJ, or KJ earns every cent of their pay.... They have to do alot behind the scenes, oftentimes this does mean working the crowd, getting the crowd interested, perhaps cracking a joke or two..... The better entertainer is the one who the better bars will hire...Not just a person standing there stone-faced popping in songs.... You need to sell Karaoke, show people that it's fun... You need to sell yourself too....Otherwise most WILL in time get bored...

While I do agree that there are people that go to bars (myself included) who likely will not sing. "Pool player", doesn't mean "non-singer", nor does it mean "we don't like or hear the music", or enjoy hearing a certain type of music... If a group of bikers walked in, I'd likely sneak on Steppenwolf.. You MUST work with the crowd you have... Many pool players do in fact sing assuming there is a genre for them as well. Or they certainly will think to themselves, "Hey, I really like that song", or similarly, "dang, that really stinks". So even if they don't sing, like Chuck mentioned, "at least they are happy and enjoying themselves".. It's YOUR gig, it's YOUR show... You need to sell it to ALL you can.. People feed off've others positive energy, In a sense, the KJ isn't much different than that DJ on a request line radio station...In such a case, sure, people make requests, but ultimately, the DJ, has more say than it appears.... Similarly the KJ, like any other entertainer has abit of a tougher job, he more indirectly has to run things, do MORE stuff behind the scenes..Like many things, a presentation is often as good as the person making it !  Or it's the teacher that sell's the subject matter... A good KJ could inspire thru personality, and music...If KJ works a wedding, does he just stand there like a bump on a log ?  Nope... How can he, he has to be presentable to all ages there, and he must mix and mingle with people, and talk their music too.... The KJ has no excuse for not knowing MUSIC....MANY genre's in fact. This is assuming he's up in front of a diverse group... He must know how to initiate, he should appear to enjoy what he does...(and much of the time of course even THAT is acting during the off days)


The KJ IS an entertainer.  One who supplies and hosts the entertainment IS an entertainer... You must have some skill to do what you do well, and rise above the others.  Otherwise, is it any wonder there's alot of competition ?  You have to sell yourself, and your show... Not just "be there"...


FUN is contageous.  It spreads !  Sometimes the host/entertainer needs to be somewhat outgoing... Not easy, I know !


One more thing.  I'm a musician, but I'm NOT a good entertainer.  It's VERY tough for me to feign exuberance when I'm down, very tough for me not to wear my mood on my lapel..... When you are in front entertaining a large crowd, regardless of what you are providing them with, GOOD ENTERTAINER goes a LONG way... Even in the bartender !!  People are out to have fun, be entertained somehow.. Not all that supply entertainment are decent entertainers, however today with a paucity of jobs, and bar revenue being what it is.... and all the laws making it so tough for bars to thrive... If  you were a bar owner.... Would you just want someone who hands out a microphone ?  Or would you want someone who entertains your crowd too ?



Agreed, and this is sometimes VERY VERY tough !!   It takes an entertainer to do it IMO...

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I've read this thread several times now, and I agree with quite a few things, and I disagree with some things said. I'm not gonna get into the debate of what is right and what is wrong. All I can talk about is what works for me, and lord knows I hate talking about me. My opinions are my own, not meant as a pro or con to anything that's already been said.
I like the fact that I can entertain. But having said that, my ability to do so comes from years of being on stage, where you have no choice but to play the front man and keep the show going. Not everyone can do this. Does that make them a bad KJ, hardly.
Some folks like shows that are to the point, no bs, let's get to the singing. I guess that's okay for some, just not for me.  
I honestly believe that the folks that come to my shows, not only come to sing, but be entertained. I think the families that come like the shows because they know that I don't exclude anyone, not even the kids.  
Last Saturday night in the middle of my first set, I stopped what I was doing, and got every kid in the audience to come up on stage. We did the 'Hokey Pokey', 'Old MacDonald', 'Head, Shoulders, Feet and Toes' and the kids loved it. So did the parents. It took a total of 15 mins. to win over every family in the place. That one thing set the tone for the rest of the evening. It showed them, that yes, I was human, I was approachable, that I sincerely wanted everyone in the place to have a good time that night.
During the same set, I sang Elvis 'Can't Help Falling in Love' as I walked around a group of about 50 older guest, who were staying with us for the weekend. As I sang to the women, I watched them turn to their husbands and smile, I watched them hold hands. All it took was one simple song to win them over.  
I sang Bowie's 'Changes' and saw the yuppies turn to each other with a look of 'holy moley, he's doing a Bowie tune'. I did Johnny Cash 'Hurt' for the younger crowd, who knew the song from not only NIN, but Cash himself. By the way, that song never fails to get applause, from all ages. I did middle of the road stuff, I sang Jimmy Buffett, I did CCR. In one set, I did songs from the 50's on up to today, a little something for everyone.  
When my set was done, did I go hide, no way. I walked around the restaurant and bar handing out song books/slips, welcoming them and thanking them for coming out.
At the end of the evening, most of my tips had come from the non-singers, each with a compliment on how much they enjoyed the 'SHOW'. When folks walk out, it's no longer 'just karaoke' it's a show, with all the silliness, jokes, birthday/wedding dedications.  
Yes I enjoy what I do. Am I tired at the end of the night, you bet your arse I am. But I walk out the door knowing that the evening ended with a job well done.
I'm new to this biz, my reputation is the only thing I have, so yes I do go above and beyond the call of duty. Does the job require me to do it, not really, but my pride does, my sense of professionalism does.  
I recently turned 50, and I guess I could sit around like a lot of folks and think back on my glory days, but my preference is to continue to make those days happen even now.
Does all my ramblings and bragging make me better than anyone else, no way, not even close. I just enjoy what I do. I give the kind of show that I would want to go see.
So if you want to go to a show, where all the KJ does is load up a tune and call out a name, then please don't ever come to one of my shows. I wouldn't want to bore you to death while I'm entertaining the audience. I have an ego big enough for all of us,  I don't need to cater to yours. At my shows, everyone has fun, not just the singers.
And understand, I'm not slamming anyone, just giving an honest, blunt, to the point opinion. Everyone has an opinion, and I've just stated mine. Thank you for indulging me once again. And please, when you read this, please read it with a sense of humor, don't take things so serious, I don't.

James
Maninblack

P.S. Yeah I know what you're thinking....good grief this guy is as long winded as Kappy....

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I serve no man and am loyal to only one God.

Being critical of a person's success in any respect speaks volumes about the lack of your own.

Love as though you've never been hurt, Dance as though no one's watching, Sing as though God Himself were listening.

I see, there could be some hope for all of you.  :yes:  :hug:   I didn't say to be a hog all night, just entertain and keep as many people as possible, in the bar spending money.  If you're as good as you think you are, you will.  :hi5:  :wave:

Good thing I don't drink, liquor tends to make me talkative.  I come out've my shell when I'm drinking.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Man... I say something in passing as an observation and it gets taken on a tangent. The point I was TRYING to make is that a KJ's job is different from just a "singer"... not underrating what KJs do. I have a lot of respect for good KJs cause lord knows I have dealt with enough bad ones. The main point I was making is that a KJ is not there to entertain people who don't want to sing. People who aren't there singing, who don't WANT to sing and who aren't enjoying themselves CAN leave... just don't blame the KJ. The fact is that a person doesn't have to be an entertainer to be a KJ, in fact most here in Canada that I have encountered, are not. Usually it's some person who knows how to sing (sometimes) and how to run the equipment (again, sometimes). I wish more KJs took James' attitude here, I hate going out for the evening and having a KJ who really doesn't give a crap about the singers... it has happened more than once. One person I used to love going to the show of was a big smarta$$, he used to make jokes and make people participate. He was in my old town.. I have yet to find someone like that here. In a perfect world, all KJs would be entertainers, the fact is that they are not. That is all I was trying to say. James... we need a good KJ ...you need to come where we are  LOL

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Te audire no possum. Musa sapientum fixa est in aure. (I can't hear you. I have a banana in my ear.)

What everyone seems to forget is that non singers have mouths.   They talk about places that are fun and places that are not.    It only takes a few big mouths, to hurt your reputation.    And if they are in a bar and they start to talk about the lousy time they had....   If it was a karaoke night, who do you think is taking the fall for the bad night?     MR. KJ. in attendance.    Why?   He's there.   It's his responsibility.     Whether he wants it or not.     Big shoes to fill.    How do you want people to talk about the places you play?     I don't give them too much to say, that is bad.   I can't afford to.   And neither can the bar owner.   Reputation, reputation, reputation......Protect yours, it's worth a lot of [highlight=crimson]CASH[/highlight]....  LMAO

Just be very careful using the word non-singer here....got me in trouble  :drunk:

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LOOK! It's Kitty Doo!

When I am doing baby got back and 3 or 4 bbw come up on stage and rub their butts on mine are they

1. non-singers
2. dancers
3. booty shakers
4. part of the entertainment
5. illegal participants
6. line dancers
7. just some gals having fun
8. my friends who I love deeply
9. my friends who I dont love deeply
10. spys that are keeping track of what we play

How you  can put people in classifications or pigeon holes and treat them different is totally beyond my comprehension as a KJ DJ friend or anything else...

Entertainer or just KJ?. hmmm. Kinda splitting hairs here. Like an earlier statement said, If all you do is play music on disk, that doesnt make you an entertainer. Anyone can do that. Even a machine.

It's what goes on in between songs, and the ability to help a singer, etc. To actually have total control of the audiance. That's an entertainer. You don't even have to be a singer, just the ability to be entertaining and control the flow of the entertainment. A comedian is an entertainer. An MC is an entertainer,. Even a politision can be an entertainer if he captures your interest. Same as a good hot dog vender out selling his hot dogs by being loud and fun is an entertainer. My crazy Uncle that likes to do hand shadow puppet shows on the kitchen wall, is also an entertainer. It's all a matter of perspective.

I think a GOOD DJ or KJ is by the very essence of the show, an entertainer.

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"Real life doesn't start untill the music plays." LSK.