Karaoke Scene's Karaoke Forums
https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/

Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=29330		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Insane KJ [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 10:44 am ]
Post subject:  Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
http://docs.justia.com/cases/federal/di ... 695367/107

Pg 6, Para 10:

"Defendant testified that approximately a month or two before the filing of this lawsuit, he purchased a computer drive which had Sound Choice tracks on it and other tracks with the logo removed because he was told he could not be sued if he used tracks with the logos wiped."
Author:  timberlea [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 12:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
So much for SC losing in court. Does anyone have anything showing a host winning a case that went to court?
Author:  djjeffross [ Fri Jan 17, 2014 1:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Just read the full 15 pages. This guy was indeed using tracks that he did not have discs for and admitted to some unsavory behavior (ie: deleting tracks he was not 1 to 1 with). He had over 20 rigs out at some point in time and even tried to avoid service until publication service was rendered.

With all that being said, we will have to wait and see what happens in the trial for damages.
Author:  djjeffross [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 9:49 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Timberlea. I forgot to mention that this is not an actual case that has gotten any further than discovery. The defendant has admitted to trying to circumvent legalities by purchasing a drive with all of the logos removed from the tracks to avoid being sued. He also sold copies of that drive to others. He wiped his hard drives with special software and then got rid of them claiming they were damaged.

This is a classic case of piracy and the pirate trying to cover his tracks. Unfortunately it has nothing to do with someone just using SC tracks from a HDD without permission. That kind of case would be much more interesting.
Author:  mrmarog [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
djjeffross wrote:
This is a classic case of piracy and the pirate trying to cover his tracks. Unfortunately it has nothing to do with someone just using SC tracks from a HDD without permission. That kind of case would be much more interesting.
I am assuming you mean the only thing missing from being legal is "permission"
Author:  djjeffross [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 10:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Quote:
I am assuming you mean the only thing missing from being legal is "permission"


Sorry. I am a little confused. "Permission" does not = legal. Hasn't that part already been made clear?
Author:  mrmarog [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 12:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
djjeffross wrote:
Quote:
I am assuming you mean the only thing missing from being legal is "permission"

Sorry. I am a little confused. "Permission" does not = legal. Hasn't that part already been made clear?
I am looking through the eyes of the manus. I realize that they really have no legal standing as to whether or not we can legally "shift" our music, but they, presently. are the only ones causing us stress.

So DJ what exactly would you find so interesting?
Author:  djjeffross [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 2:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Quote:
So DJ what exactly would you find so interesting?


To my knowledge and to which I admit I don't spend everyday concerned enough to keep up with it all, I have yet to see a case go to trial where the only question was whether the KJ needed permission to play tracks from their hard drive. It seems to be the norm that once a legit KJ is sued, they become panicked and feel the need to prove themselves to Slep-Tone and in turn have the case dismissed. I'm sure one day there will be someone who is not afraid of the legal machine and will stick to their guns and take up for themselves. (1 case in Florida comes to mind but he admitted to deleting the tracks).

All of the lawsuit verbiage I have seen accuses each defendant of being a pirate not a "technical infringer". A KJ who owns his library and knows that they are running a legal operation should be able to go into court and receive damages for being sued on a case that doesn't have legal standing.

If this has happened already, please point me to a case # so I can research it for myself.
Author:  chrisavis [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 3:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
I believe that someone who is legitimately 1:1, has all their discs, but ripped to a drive to conveniently run their shows, would be able to defend their actions with the right lawyer and maybe a little bit of money.

-Chris
Author:  mrmarog [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 3:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
chrisavis wrote:
I believe that someone who is legitimately 1:1, has all their discs, but ripped to a drive to conveniently run their shows, would be able to defend their actions with the right lawyer and maybe a little bit of money.-Chris
That is still BS. We don't make enough money have to pay to defend ourselves from having done nothing wrong. I quick inspection of our music should be all that is necessary. Grab 20 random songs and match them all up and out the door they/we go will a release in hand.
Author:  chrisavis [ Sat Jan 18, 2014 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
mrmarog wrote:
chrisavis wrote:
I believe that someone who is legitimately 1:1, has all their discs, but ripped to a drive to conveniently run their shows, would be able to defend their actions with the right lawyer and maybe a little bit of money.-Chris
That is still BS. We don't make enough money have to pay to defend ourselves from having done nothing wrong. I quick inspection of our music should be all that is necessary. Grab 20 random songs and match them all up and out the door they/we go will a release in hand.


I agree with you. I think this whole thing is pretty silly.

-Chris
Author:  Insane KJ [ Wed Mar 26, 2014 12:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
An interesting read regarding this case.

http://www.crowell.com/files/Terminatin ... ctices.pdf
Author:  MtnKaraoke [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Seems to me that Granito's purchase of the tracks with the logos removed and his motive as explained was the indicator.

This attorney discusses the timeline when "extending the reasoning", but the defendant's actions essentially deleted the chronological proof of when their duty to preserve the evidence became effective.

When does a lawsuit go from being a "mere possibility" to becoming the deciding factor on whether or not a person/business could be engaging in spoliation?

Apparently spoliation can be committed without culpability as in the case of a company deleting old ESI as a litigation risk management policy.

Determining Granito's state of mind at the time of the events at issue would have been much more difficult if he hadn't made that purchase.
Author:  rickgood [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:08 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
I think we,re just dealing with a new breed of stupid pirates. Although I do not advocate track piracy, the smart pirates would use hard drives loaded with everything BUT Sound Choice and Chartbusters. I'm fairly certain you could run a decent show in most places with all the other content that is available.
Author:  chrisavis [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 12:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Rick - I have been thinking about exactly that recently. I know KJBill's hard drives have replacement swipes for much of the music. I have not been on iRC recently to see if Karaoke Version tracks are being distributed but I would bet they are.

The "smart" pirates would avoid ALL US Based manufacturers.
Author:  BruceFan4Life [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 3:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Sound Choice nails one stupid KJ out of a suggested 50,000 pirate KJs and they start waving the victory flag. LOL Mission Accomplished! The other 49,999 KJ's are laughing all of the way to the bank.

A good lawyer would have come up with a better scenario to create some doubt. Could have just said that the KJ played any and all Sound Choice tracks from their original discs and only used the hard drive for other brands. Just show up with some Sound Choice originals and see how the plaintiff tries to prove their case. I've had hard drives crash on me and I never thought to save them once they died. I just buy a new one and throw the old one away. Is a judge going to just assume that my hard drive didn't die a premature death and that it had unauthorized Sound Choice material on it? Deny Deny Deny. I don't recall, your honor. My computer crashed and I had to buy a new one.....yes your honor; the dog did, in fact, eat my homework. :lol:
Author:  JimHarrington [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
BruceFan4Life wrote:
Could have just said that the KJ played any and all Sound Choice tracks from their original discs and only used the hard drive for other brands.


Would have been hard for him to explain away the video of his show (when he played SC tracks from his hard drive), or the fact that he actually sold a hard drive (containing SC tracks) to a cooperating witness.
Author:  BruceFan4Life [ Thu Mar 27, 2014 8:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
A karaoke track, from an original karaoke disc, played through a laptop's DVD drive using Siglos looks identical to a track played from the hard drive. As far as the guy selling a hard drive to an undercover karaoke investigator; his bad.
Author:  JimHarrington [ Fri Mar 28, 2014 5:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
BruceFan4Life wrote:
A karaoke track, from an original karaoke disc, played through a laptop's DVD drive using Siglos looks identical to a track played from the hard drive.


Yeah, but that would require the KJ to have discs at his station, and to put them into the laptop when playing them. The video shows that not to be the case.
Author:  Bazza [ Fri Mar 28, 2014 6:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Did TonyG Listen To Blog Advise, Or Just Dumb?
Stupid indeed. This is like buying a known stolen car and claiming "I was told I couldn't be taken to court if all the VIN numbers were removed". :lol:
Page 1 of 2 All times are UTC - 8 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
https://www.phpbb.com/