Karaoke Forums

We are starting a new LOCAL "Karaoke Association" - a front for honest KJs who don't want to be the ones who break it to the bar owners about the legal consequences of hiring a pirate. Here is what it entails:

Our primary mission is to educate bar owners at the local level about the risks associated with hiring a KJ who uses pirated material. We have found that many KJs are not willing to educate the bar owners themselves or warn them of the consequences because of their reaction. Our website, currently under construction, will offer resources for bar owners to verify that we aren't simply crying wolf.

We also will offer links to reporting sites, like those offered by Sound Choice, The KIAA, Chartbuster, etc.

Once the website is complete, we will be sending letters to every bar in our area that offers karaoke. The letters will encourage bar owners to make sure that some organization or manufacturer has indeed verified their legitimacy and will offer tips on how to spot pirated material.

I'll let you guys know how this works out.

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I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!

go for it we did the same in our little peice of the world...doing well....no bar owner will be able to say they didnt know about it

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

Athena, do you have a website I could steal ideas from?

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I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!

Good for you guys! Where are you guys located? How are you qualifying your kjs to be part of the group?

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

I will keep my Association completely neutral from my karaoke business. I am still in the development stages, but any KJ that can demonstrate 1:1 compliance to me, or if they are already certified by a manu or the KIAA will be granted membership.

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I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!

You might contact The Oregon Karaoke Assoc. http://www.orkaassoc.com I know they have been very involved in educating karaoke people in Oregon for the last four years. Also you might ask about how the vist with Kurt was while in Oregon. They might give you some assitance in your association.

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[img]<img%20src="http://i83.photobucket.com/albums/j288/miller2348/myspace/images/Funny_Pics/images/21.gif"[/img]

CHECK YOUR ATTITUDE AT THE DOOR, STICK AROUND YOU JUST MIGHT HAVE SOME FUN

troy once i get things up and running, I'm going to have to get in contact with you to help out with that... unless you want any help in the mean time, I am happy to help out any way I can. just let me know and I can get you my contact info

"Compliance to ME?"

Who are you (or your association) to demand any kind of compliance for any condition? Especially since you would be considered a competitor? While your idea is a noble one, I believe it is treading a legal tight-wire....

I can tell you this: If I were your competitor in your area and was refused by any potential customer on the basis of your "education" that you and your entire association would be on the wrong end of a restraint of trade suit.

After reading the post directly above mine I can't help but think it is a great idea!

Actually it was a great idea before he posted! The only way to win this fight is to carry it to the venues through education, the more they know about pirates and what to look for (as long as they are given legal alternatives) the better it is for karaoke in general.

The only way to get rid of piracy is to shut out the pirates from the venues.

i can see somebody showing compliance to him as a requirement for membership in his association. And the point would be to educate bar owners about piracy. Saying that bar owners should verify that their KJ is legal is fine. If he said that they had to be verified through his organization would be one thing, but just saying that "someone should verify they are legal, and here are some good ways to spot if they aren't" is fine by me... and FWIW I am about 50 miles away from Troy, so I'm not necessarily competition, but things put out in our area would affect me too.

hhb119fist,

Being 1:1 you should easily be able to verify to a venue that you are legal a plus is that as the manus get the auditing system down to where there is a shorter wait for certifying libraries the only effect on you should be a positive one.

Okay, but what do you do in this scenario:

A local KJ is not interested in joining ANY association and this new association (of competitors) is now "educating" his customers to check up on him or risk being sued?... That's a countersuit just waiting to happen.

And why would he sue if he doesn't want to join, to have a complaint against the association they would have to turn down his request to join, if he asked to join he would already know the criteria to become a member so he would still have no complaint. If he is legal he has no complaint, so the only one who would have a complaint is someone who was turned down by a venue, so then the complaint would be against the venue, who could say I already had a KJ so I didn't need another or I simply didn't like the guys personality.

If he already has the venue and the venue decides to ask him for proof that he is legal it is a simple matter of showing the disc to the venue still no cause for filing a suit, unless of course he has no disc!

Yes you could file a lawsuit but you may as well chuck a 300 pound rock at them instead because both are going to go about the same distance.

Please don't answer a post you obviously don't understand.
The post does not mention anything about discs, hard drives or computers.
If you have a question about it, please state the question and I'll simplify the answer as much as possible for you.

Please don't make post in a thread where you obviously don't understand the concept of reality of what was actually said. If you need help understanding the concept just ask and I will try to the best of my ability to explain it in the simplest possible terms for you!

I don't know how other KJs can file action against us. People band together in business every day. There are unions for skilled tradesmen. They require certain educational and legal requirements for memberships. Wedding vendors offer "one-stop shopping" associations that put on expos. They also require things like insurance, etc. I just don't see how forming an association is going to put me at any legal risk. But, you can bet that I will consult with an attorney.

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I'm not a cheerleader, but I paid for my pom poms with my own money!

I don't think that this has any intention if implicating any particular KJ as being a pirate. Rather, the intention is to make bar owners aware of the consequences of hiring any KJ that is actually operating illegally.

Therefore, if the bar owner chooses to act on the information and carry out his/her own due-diligence as to the risks of hiring a particular KJ, I don't see how that could result in a successful suit against the "association". Nor can I see how a KJ could successfully sue the bar owner for not hiring him/her due to said KJ not being able to satisfy the bar owner of the legality of the karaoke operation.

However, if the "association" were to advise against the hiring of a particular KJ because they believed said KJ was a pirate, then it could well find itself in deep poo poo! But, that is not the primary mission as stated.

Ding ding ding!..... Give Murray C a SEE-GAR!

If the association were to do anything to bias a purchase against any person or company, especially a non-member in favor of a member, it will be legally expensive for the association and they are opening up ALL of the membership to the same liability.

I can imagine this happening quite easily with KIAA their safe harbor crap.

you have to know what KIAA is first!

You have to know what the KIAA is first

Perhaps Toger could help you with that since as he stated he was there at the inception of the KIAA and helped to form it (although he doesn't know who runs it, who owns it, where it is, who any contacts are, what any phone numbers are, or what the address is) so he is knowledgeable about it!


However, reading everything that was written might help, again where is your lawsuit!