Karaoke Forums

Ya that thought just occurred to me right after i hit the submit button. Nothing like posting something that makes you feel like a complete moron after.. Ah well

Well if your in the mood to sell them, I'll sure you will get MUCH better offers than mine, but if you are willing to take small payments and send them when they are actually paid for, i can offer you $500 total. let me know. *lol*

I'm sure Chris could make you a better offer if you were interested.

-James

Terrific business sense and a show of ethics. Thanks for that post.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

It should never have been taken away. This new system assumes that all KJ's are pirates and demands that we pay for it. Just how unfair is that?

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

HarringtonLaw, Can you clarify something? Can you call SC to get permission to media shift the discs that you already own? And if so, are you still charged the monthly fee?

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

As it stands today, no. The only current mechanism for getting media-shifting permission is to become a HELP licensee.

Judging from your non-answer to my question, I'm gonna say that you were aware of the audit and certification program, and you chose not to take part. Our decision to end that program may be a lot of things, but it's not unfair.

Thank you for your reply. So, you're saying NO there will be no monthly fee if you become a HELP licensee. But on the website, when you click on the HELP tab to sign up it says you WILL be charged a monthly fee. I don't understand.

As far as the audit. I was hoping to take advantage of the free audits at the time but didn't have enough discs to qualify. I was waiting to see if it was going to be modified. Thanks for your help.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

I think he was saying 'no' to the first q, not the second.

My mistake. I read it wrong. Thanks for clarifying that.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

When Kurt was offering audits, nobody wanted them and told the ones that were audited that there was no benefit having one done. Now that that option is gone (I took advantage of it years ago) the only option is to join the PEP program at a monthly cost if you media shift SC products (your option to media shift with permission only which you could have had with a very inexpensive one time cost). Now, if you choose to continue using SC product in a media shift you have to pay what they are asking for otherwise don't use the product or play the disc as it was intended when it was sold to you so how is it extortion when you had easy cheap options before. Being certified has it privileges. Who is sorry now?

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

I don't think it iwll let anyone off the hook. For years Kurt ask EVERYONE using his product to prove 1:1 to weed out the pirates of his product. Even a majority of the presumed legit KJs balked at his request calling it an invasion of their rights to run their businesses. He had no choice to move forward to force anyone using his products in a shifted format that he was ok with as long as you just proved you had 1:1. since so few took advantage and blasted the process he changed the process to make everyone using his product shifted pay an ongoing fee to have that right pirate or not (yep unfortunately the legit are lumped in with the pirates together) still does not give "KJ Bill" a pass because if he is using a loaded hardrive to run his show he will have to also pay a fee just the same and usually those operators don't last too long because they don't have the income to stay in business perhaps. Another way is that the pirate KJs will come out in the open to join and then expose them selves to other litigation's outside of the Karaoke producer (Kurt). I personally see this program evolving to help the legit operator move forward down the road. Maybe it is some sort of way to backdoor the audit system then once audited the fee would be dropped or vastly reduced. Who knows?????? Just maybe "KJ Bill" will just go away........... maybe it is time everyone steps back from the trees and looks at the forest.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

It's a 'safe haven' program, which in all honesty will pull some pirates into port. Does not matter whether it's media shifting pirates, or purchased hard drive pirates, all pirates welcome!

Any pirate who forks over $200 of their plunder every month will be making those who don't walk the drop a dime plank!

safe haven sounds about right

investigator: i see the SC logo, how many SC tracks do you have?
host: 16,500, why?
investigator: did you buy all of those discs?
host: hell no, but i do pay the 200 a month license like the guy down the road who did.
investigator: yabol, i see notink, i know notink!

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

A point that needs to be emphasized: there's a big difference between people who pirated the discs and people who used the discs appropriately and didn't get the audit, for whatever reason.

The jocks who abided by the standards but skipped the certification are, on substance, the best customers SC has. They're using the IP exactly the way SC wants them to, and sparing SC the cost of the audit (which HarringtonLaw says was offered at below cost, so the certified jocks actually cost them money).

I don't fall into either category (I don't have certification and I don't need it) but there's a little effort, unfair I think, to cast aspersions on the people who used the material honestly and either resisted or procrastinated on certification.

Why don't you just say what you really want to say to all of those people here???????
I (Rumbolt) got mine and you didn't!!! NA NA NANA BooBoo!!!! Thbtpbpbtpbptbpbpbtpbt!!!!

Watching the great John Belushi on the SNL anniversary special reminded me of one of his great lines from Animal House. For the sake of decorum, I'll abbreviate it as, "YFU,YTU!"

Don't know what made me think of that just now, looking at my Sound Choice discs.

I don't think i am casting aspirsions on anyone. Just pointing out the REALIT"Y" of the EXACT situation that i myself am in.

Also if you want the cliffnotes version of how this whole process has transpired it would go something like this.

When it was just discs and nothing else it was
"You can make ONE backup from an ORIGINAL Soundchoice CD, but you have shelf the disk and not use it"

After a Little Time Passes....

soundchoice: Gee, people are starting to take advantage of the orginal statements about backup and making multiple copies to use in multiple shows. We'd better stop that

soundchoice goes to the KJ and asks :we just want to make sure you bought our product, we don't care about the shift, may we please look at your discs?

KJ:Screw you soundchoice, I bought my discs, my word out to be good enough for you

And Yet More time passes
"Gee this piracy is completely out of conrol, pretty soon we won't be able to afford to make any more music

Soundchoice:We have decided that if you want to RIP your originally owned discs you need to get our permision. All we ask is that you submit to an audit to prove that you own 1 disc for every track that you put on the hard drive. We will be offering free audits at our upcoming meetup

KJs:It's too far, i can't go it costs too much money to travel plus Screw you soundchoice i don't want you interfering in my business

And "YET MORE TIME PASSES

Soundchoice:Audits will still be offered, but we can't afford to keep doing them for free, so it will now cost $150 to offset the costs involved but we will be willing [ to consider exceptions on a case by case basis

KJ:Screw you soundchoice, we don't want audits. I paid for my discs, that should be good enough

Then YET more time passes

soundchoice:AFter talking to Chris Avis we have decided to offer a limited amount of FREE Audits. You must have bought 150 discs worth of music, but we are still willing to consider exceptions.

And finally we come to today

Soundchoice:Ok, we tried the nice approach. We tried to be reasonable. Everyone is ignoring us, here's how it's going to go down. We can't stop the piracy anymore, but If want to transfer our Red Label product to computer, you need to get a license end of story.

And so here we all are. It's not like they wanted to be the hard line dicks that everyone is making them out to be - but if we are honest about it, what choice did they really have? Just give up?

JC, I'll give you this--you've put as flattering a face on it as can be done. Even relying on that account alone, I don't think they're in the right. That's not a reflexive or biased opinion: I thought they were in the right when they were in the right (which covers most of your narrative) and thought they were in the wrong when they're in the wrong (with the new announcement).

There's more that can be done for the people getting screwed by this, IMHO. If you guys want to stand still while KJ Bill operates with impunity and you pay his freight, you're making your own bed. I'd throw my whole system off a cliff before I'd pay a penny for HELP.

Yeah, Rumbolt! You don't know everybody's situation. Maybe some of us just couldn't afford it at the time. Maybe some of us chose to use that $200 to pay bills or put food on the table. Maybe some of us have medical issues and needed that money to pay for prescriptions. Yes, there are a lot of reasons why someone would choose to use $200 for something other than an audit.

Also did you stop to think that some of us may only be doing 2 or three shows per month? So, before you come off with your condesinding, mightier than thou attitude, stop and think... there's a reason for everything.

I wish that I had gotten mine (certification) too, but I didn't. Hopefully, Kurt will have a change of heart and bring it back.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

Please explain to my how I cost SC money since I am a "certified"? I went through the audit process prior to shifting with permission.
If a jock was using the discs without shifting permission, they were not using the material as intended by the mfg. According to Kurt. Simple enough. His product, his rules. Pretty simple. We may not agree but that is how I see it.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

please explain how Alan cost SC money?

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens