Karaoke Forums

Incorrect. Both companies have stated straight out that they do not have authorization to give permission for the shift.

What they WILL do is say that they might turn a blind eye to the shift if a KJ either owns all of the discs, or pays them a fee ( Stellar), or pays a "settlement". It is my opinion that if the companies turn a blind eye to the shifting, it MAY be actionable later by the publisher/owners- kind of a civil version of being an accessory. That is merely a GUESS on my part, but I feel the possibility is there.

That's assuming, of course, that some court finds media shifting to be an icky in the future, which has not yet happened.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Yup, the "good ol' boy" network is a toughie. I didn't know the venue was a political one ( i.e. run by committee). Thanks for your quick and straightforward reply.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

This is correct.



This is not correct. We do not "turn a blind eye" to the shift. That is, the eye is not "blind." We grant a covenant not to sue IF the KJ submits to and passes an audit OR IF the KJ settles, deletes his pirated materials, and consents to a future audit. But that covenant not to sue is based upon an informed assessment of the situation, not a "blind" approach.



We don't represent the music publishers, so we have no way of forcing them to agree contractually to a particular position with regard to media-shifting. Regardless of what the state of the law is today, they could, in our common-law system, take the position in the future that media-shifting is a copyright infringement when done for commercial purposes. That's unlikely, but it's unpredictable.

Don't forget to add that they will also charge you more of your hard earned dollars for the "privilege" of submitting to an audit, event though you already paid for the discs in the first place!
Nothing like taking your real customers for more!

The audit is not a privilege, it is a requirement of them granting you the permission to have the privilege of copying their product and their trademark.
The fee you paid for your disks in the first place did not include the right or the privilege to copy their product or their trademark.

Here here! EXACTLY!!!!!

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Ding Ding Ding!!!!!! We have a winner!!!!!!!!!

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Sound Choice and Chartbuster Certified

Cheer cheer! EXACTLY!!!!!

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"Just Say NO, To Justin Bieber & His Beatle Haircut"

$1 a song?......just like the soda/water drinkers.....

What about making mp3s from a regular music cd....that you purchased?

I think many of you are not reading the safeharbor agreement that venues are supposed to sign. It basically says that SC won't sue a club if the KJ is legit... HOWEVER, it also says that if SC determines that their KJ is operating illegally (with no proof of such activity) the club shall have 30 days to FIRE the kj and get a "new approved" KJ OR they WILL BE SUED.

Basically, SC wants to control who they hire....

It's all about control.

Any venue that signs up for this is making a mistake.

I believe it is all about fair, honest, open, ethical business practice.

The information is out there. It is what it is.

Cooperation between the venues that employ karaoke entertainment services and the mfr's of karaoke media will benefit all concerned with the issue of piracy.

In my opinion the Safe Harbor agreement amounts to a pledge to engage in this business without supporting trademark infringement and/or outright theft.

How would it harm a business to determine whether the karaoke entertainment they are paying for is legit?

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Never the same show twice!

I feel like we are running circles here, folks.

Will any of the companies like Sound Choice ever be moving into our digital age? Is there ANY possibility that they may start selling digital copies of their product online? If so, would it be like iTunes and bill per song and/or 'set', or just per 'set'? ( 'Set' refers to what the companies CD's are now, a whole setlist of songs. )

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Get up and try singing. Don't be afraid, it's only massive fun and the best stress relief I know of! =D

"If my love were in my arms, and the night were long, what reason would I have to wrench the silence into song." - To me from my Sally. <3

It's not the business that is affected, it's the KJ who is hired/fired that is. I think you're missing the point that Chip just made.



Let's put this in a way that you might understand.... Suppose you are working for "XYZ Bar," and you operate your show from a PC. Someone representing SC (or Harrington Law) comes in to see your show one night, and witnesses this. They now report this back to "The Powers That Be," and now your name is added to SC's lawsuit. "XYZ Bar" has registered to Safe Harbor", so now they receive a notification that you (the hired KJ at the Bar) is operating illegally. Based on the terms of their agreement with Safe Harbor, they now have to fire you within 30 days, or they will be sued too.

Where's the proof that you are operating illegally? SC has deemed that you are running an illegal show. By being named in SC's lawsuit, IT MUST BE SO. Once they have been notified, do you think that "XYZ Bar" is going to wait a full 30 days before they fire you? I know I wouldn't. I'd do it immediately (before you have to appear for your next show), and I would inform SC that I have done so as quickly as possible. So, "XYZ Bar" now fires you. There's nothing in the Safe Harbor agreement that states if you are accused of running an illegal show, that the Venue can determine otherwise. You are now going to have to prove to SC that you are operating legally. Given the benefit of the doubt that you are running a 1:1 system, how quickly can you get this resolved? Is it going to be within 30 days? For most, I somehow doubt it. You are now out of a job because of this new accusation you are running a show illegally. But, you don't have to worry, because

That scenario isn't realistic. Number one, if you are a working kj and you have media shifted SC content and want to use it at your shows then GET CERTIFIED. No different if you want to play CB. If these terms are unacceptable to you as a working kj then I suggest either deleting these tracks off your 'puter or go back to using discs. Putting the venue at risk because you don't think you should have to pay for an audit isn't a good business plan, especially if that venue has signed on for the Safe Harbor program.
None of this is NEW info. Everyone in the karaoke industry knows whats going on. Number two: Sound Choice doesnt walk into your venue and sue you without substantial info. Sure, people have been named that are legit operators but it's very rare and not as common as some would make you believe.

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Sound Choice and Chartbuster Certified

Let me see if I understand you correctly: Your suggestion is that every "working KJ" who has been working -whether a year or 20 years- simply and all of a sudden submit any inspection at any whim by any manufacturer and pay for it because you are now labeled a pirate by the same manufacturers that will refuse to be just as accountable for their own actions?

So you want to purchase their products and THEN pay them again to use the product? Are you listening to what you are saying?



Sound Choice does in fact, name legit operators and don't fool yourself into believing otherwise. Wake up and smell the coffee... Why do they hide what they do by demanding a confidentiality agreement?

It amazes me that these manufacturers can produce and sell karaoke material with no licensing, and then mark it all as "used by permission." Which is, to me, flat-out fraud. Then they get sued by the publisher for copyright infringement... for millions of dollars of theft.

But apparently to you, that's okay.... and now you'll defend them pimping this business at every turn.

And it's not as rare as they would make you believe, either.

More hearsay.

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"Just Say NO, To Justin Bieber & His Beatle Haircut"

Only if you mediashifted their product.

Comprende?

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"Just Say NO, To Justin Bieber & His Beatle Haircut"

Citation please on alleged agreement?

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"Just Say NO, To Justin Bieber & His Beatle Haircut"