Karaoke Forums

Whoopie!!!! So you know more hosts in California than me or Rumbolt. I'm so thrilled for you! So, what does that prove???

And I suppose you have polled EVERY SINGLE ONE OF THEM to determine that nobody really cares??????????????

Maybe being called a thief or even being referred to as someone who condones stealing gets under your skin... Well, making GENERALIZED STATEMENTS that appear to LUMP EVERYONE into the same category get under mine.


I stand by this correction.

I guess it appears that I do (since YOU decided to make that specific comment to me HERE after I had done that to 2 of DannyG's posts (in a different topic thread)). And I'm not the only one in this Forum who has used that style of making a Quote and adding the comment of "There, I fixed it for you" right after making the Quote. I haven't seen you jump on any of them when they've done it either. At least I didn't change the meaning of what you wrote by twisting words around. I just changed the GENERALIZED STATEMENT to make it APPLY TO YOU.

But one thing I WILL APOLOGIZE for, is making that reference (within my correction to you) about being a retired host. I only wrote that because you made mention of me correcting "hosts posts" in the first place, and felt that the added text about being a "Retired Host" would push your buttons. It was a childish retaliation to your comment, and I am sorry.

Of course you are right cue hasty generalizations are a fallacy of logic. Then again other hosts on this forum have engaged in them, so I don't feel so all alone. If I were to amend my original post I guess a safe estimation of concern would be to say more hosts don't care as opposed to those that do care. After all only a minority of hosts frequent these forums. Just like a small fraction of the total hosts attend these manu events and conventions. The majority of hosts do their jobs and stay focused on their business's, they really don't want any hassle, they just want to be left alone.

Shhhhhh......

And, you have seen me get on some of their cases (from time to time) as well when it came to making a generalized statement that lumps people into 1 category, so I haven't singled you out on that.

Congrats Cueball,
As you know we have had the same experience as you. Venues contact us that we never even heard of and we are turning away venues weekly do to not having a system or host available. Being certified has improved our business greatly.

Of course you are in one of the high profile areas where multiple sweeps have been made, so you would get some relief I would guess. If things did not improve for the certified hosts in such locations, then you would have to deem the whole legal process approach as a bigger failure than it is already nationally speaking. Despite the best efforts of the legal process manus there are more illegal hosts today than when this whole legal process started. So nationally it is not really working.

I was checking out the link to the Sound Choice certified KJ lists. It seems that there were less than a dozen certifications done in 2013. Obama Care is doing better than that.

Latest update:

A local venue just last night contacted me on facebook. Our conversation later today included them telling me that they found my information on the SC website and that they wanted to be assured that the KJ they hired was working on the right side of the issue. We have scheduled a meeting to discuss options. I hate that the SC website was working for me, NOT! It's working in my world.

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No venue to big or too small. From your den to the local club or event, we have the music most requested. Great sounding system!

you are lucky, as I have to be circumspect. I can and do add an anti-piracy page to my mailer, and can use the fact that I am OMD based to help sell my services, but God forbid I mention SC- it would negate everything and get me shown to the door in a most unfriendly manner.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

I'm going to say the majority of bar owners I've done karaoke for have no idea that there are different brands of karaoke songs, much less a web site where they could find a km who was "certified" by a single manufacturer. Sometimes belief and reality has to be suspended to read this forum.

I don't want to discount the circumstances anyone has in their particular geography, but Rick's comment holds true for my area. In fact, it holds true not just for the venue owners, but the singers as well. They don't know and they don't care.

I don't put manufacturer ID's in my books. But I do have people looking at my KJ screen most nights I host where they do see disc ID's. Almost weekly, I will have someone ask me "How do you know which one to choose?" or "What does that code mean?" (in reference to the DiscID column in Karma).

I refined my explanation to the following -

All of the DiscID's are different cover bands. Some are better than others.

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-Chris

I have people say to me "This not the song I wanted to sing"!

Me: "That is what you requested."

Them: "But it doesn't sound like that at so and so's"

Me: "What brand was it"

Them: "I don't know, but it wasn't that one"

Me: "Well the next time you go there pay attention to the splash screen for info on who made it"

Them: "OK, I'll try"

I have heard this a hundred times.

But I have never had a bar owner ask me if I was "legal", "certified", "owned all my music", or a member of any organization. Likewise I have never had an owner tell me that I couldn't play a certain brand either.

Just because you never experienced that, doesn't mean it never happens.

Yes, that is true Cue. But, I do live an area that was one of the hardest hit by lawsuits, so I bet my statement holds truer for most hosts than not.

I believe you have created this scenario for yourself.


What does that anti-piracy page say? I'd like to see your message.



Again, if the general consensus is that the vast majority of bar staff (owners, managers or whoever books entertainment) don't know and don't care about brands or the source of the KJ/Host's karaoke tracks... how did those people form their anti-SC opinion? Why is the only option for them to align with your perspective?

How many of them would seek more information before making a business decision that could affect the potential earnings of an evening of entertainment?

Specifically, what would motivate them to single out one brand of karaoke tracks?

That would be like someone telling their mechanic: "Craftsman, Snap-On, MAC, Stanley, DeWalt, Klutch are all good, but you can't use Husky tools when working for me." A pro would tell that customer that the tools used pose no risk and that their use helps to provide the best overall customer experience and that includes satisfaction.

It seems to me that you are tacitly admitting that there are no 1:1 operators in your area (that you know of) that could provide services without exposing the venue to risk from SC.

How long have you been without any legit competition?

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Never the same show twice!

Seems to me that you are tacitly implying something that I never stated for reasons only you might understand.

As stated several times in the past:

Running a business - any business - requires attention to all of it's many facets. Anything that can interrupt the flow and organization of that business can be detrimental.
No business needs waves made that can cause such a disruption.
I am in one of the least hit ( and least damaged ) areas, yet SC made enough noise to get noticed. Hence, many venues in the area will not even allow their tracks to be played.

Additionally, many venues no longer allow public or media show advertisement, causing the KJ to rely on texting/e-mailing. As a matter of fact, I only have ONE venue that still allows me to advertise, even though I am OMD based and have explained the situation.

Avoiding waves. That simple. The average venue owner just wants to hire entertainment, have it make them money, pay them, and be done. The K.I.S.S. principle. They don't need or want complications. Even educating them is a complication that many would rather skip.

However, I would certainly not dispute the fact that there are plenty of track thieves ( real pirates) in the area. Unfortunately, it is difficult to get venues to take the time to distinguish between PIrates, Media Shifters ( apparently SC has the same problem), Download, and OMD based hosts in terms of the possibility of threatened litigation from SC or maybe PR. Many just say screw it and simply don't want to be bothered.

We also have many hosts who have not stolen any music, but were named in the failed mass suit that SC attempted anyway, causing waves both for them and their venues.

As far as I know, of the 20 or so named, there were only 3 pirates - all of whom are still in business today.

I believe that even as an OMD based host I would have a problem if it were not for my longevity and success in the area.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

"Running a business - any business - requires attention to all of it's many facets."

Yep and that includes all laws and the policies of vendors from Coca Cola to Microsoft.

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You can be strange but not a stranger

The difference is tim the really large companies like the one's run by the Coke brothers can influence elections and laws effecting their business interests. Now that the Supreme Court has decided that corporations can give unlimited amounts of money as well as wealthy individuals it threatens to adversely effect our whole Democratic process. They can give money to both sides and have legislation crafted to protect and promote their business interests, not always for the benefit of the country as a whole.

The Koch brothers and Coca-Cola are not the same.

Again, not discounting what goes on in other areas, but I have been asked about certifications and legalities.

I have posted before about being cold called by venues who found me on the Sound Choice certified hosts page. Legalities and certifications were topics of conversation during negotiations at 4 of the 8 venues we work. Importantly, this topic was initiated by the venues. But it isn't a topic we revisit after starting a gig. I occasionally show venues how much new music I have purchased for the rigs they have on site and I have used some new music purchasing to push for rate increases, but being legal or certified doesn't normally come up again.

In all fairness, I have had a few people over the years do what mrmarog mentioned - "Song X sounds different over at bar Y". In those cases I try to find that version for them, but it is pretty rare.

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-Chris