Karaoke Forums

I am not talking about the graphics he googled, I am assuming those are just pictures for the instrumental sections - I could be wrong - but even that wouldn't make the final result any less homemade other than the fact he didn't literally create each graphic. You cannot make a karaoke disc without having some kind of swiping program (Karaoke Builder for example) for the words - which is what I AM talking about. Actually adding the lyrics to the program, tapping out the lyrics to get them close, choosing the fonts & layouts, creating the swipes for the lyrics, fine tuning the swipes - adding Googled graphics to opening, instrumental (like DK) and closing screens and then creating a cdg out of that project. Homemade!
And legalities aside, I am just talking about the homemade part - not where it ended up, but I still agree Youtube had every right to pull those.

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Have a look at this please.
http://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2010 ... raoke-cds/

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Exemplary Сasual Dating

Sadly that pretty much nails it.

What really sucks is that as a KJ, I loved doing this; but the climate got to hot to play the tracks we bought online (from places like karaoke version) or strip out the lyrics and made in the builder software.

That being said, we did want to try buying the minus one stuff on KV (like guitar) AND buy the regular karaoke version, and then re-sync the track so people could sing and play along, kind of like open mic karaoke. But again, too much legal issue.

In the end, it beginning to be just not ne worth the risk of having something unique at your show.

If the bar isn't paying for performance rights to BMI or some other agency, you can get in just as much trouble for using Sound Choice discs as you can using home made discs.

I would think (but could be wrong) that a KJ in a bar playing an instrumental backing track that was legally purchased would be just as legal as a DJ playing a legally purchased track in the same bar. (It's assumed here the bar has paid its BMI, ASCAP, etc. fees.)

I would guess that the only infringement would be if the lyrics were displayed on a bar TV, as that would violate the copyright on the lyrics. Same as if you stole a page from a Stephen King novel. and displayed it in public for business purposes.

Even a typed or hand-written lyric sheet on paper would technically be a copyright infringement if used outside the home.

But I'd also guess the combination of a legal backing track with an infringing copy of the song lyrics (a home-baked karaoke track) would carry an extremely, extremely low risk of prosecution if used in a bar show. Not zero risk, but dang low.

Karaoke has both mechanical and live components, so ASCAP does require a license based on DJ/karaoke...

I can't find any details on what you can/can't do in regards to karaoke however, so I'd be lying if I said with a license all things are possible :/

I do not think that is an issue with a simple printed lyrics sheet. Music licesnes are easy to get and when the club are paying their PRO's, the music is covered under them. A printed lyric sheet is not violating 'sync' I wouldn't think since nothing is being displayed, nothing is 'sync'd'. I get people who bring in plain instrumentals often with nothin but a printed lyric sheet or just memorized the lyrics.

There is a company in Portland and Seattle that have been making their own graphic tracks from instrumentals they buy for YEARS, even had a national write up in a New York publication about it - doesn't seem like it's a cause for concern.

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when it comes to karaoke; it seems that FEAR is the soup of the day. There are always people out there trying to scare people into not doing something karaoke related. So tiresome.

Why are you guys going in circles here. The answer is NO! ... plain and simple. If it don't belong to you then don't waste your time brainwashing yourself into thinking it does.

Look at all the crap Weird Al went through with his compilations.

If you still want to continue. I suggest start here as a "publisher" and then follow all their guidelines as they arise.
http://www.ascap.com/join

If you write your own (@$%&#!) and publish your own (@$%&#!) then join as both "Publisher & Writer"

Would still like to see ANY case where a kj was legitimately sued for using a home made track in their own show only - not distributing or selling, or giving away the track, but simply using it in a karaoke show (where PRO fees are being paid properly by the club, not a place that aren't paying and get nailed for that first off).

Then show me ONE single instance where a home user that made a track for his personal use only got nailed for ANYTHING. Again, not a case where they are distributing, selling, giving away free music, sharing etc., personal use only.

I'll wait.....May take an infinite amount of time to find a case.

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not for nothing and I don't post much but you want to see history of someone violating and got caught doing what you do....keep doing it and you will be the history that proves it's wrong...if YouTube is blocking you, you definitely are in some kind violation, if they allowed your work to remain they would be held liable....best heed advice unless of course you have a big fat portfolio....infringement penalties are not cheap....be careful

Posting something up on YouTube would bring a former of distributing / file sharing. Not "personal use".

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I've seen plenty of karaoke tracks on YouTube but I've never heard of anyone being sued for putting them there.

Why would you even know about it, there are hundreds of thousands, if not millions of civil lawsuits and criminal cases that are carried out every year and the vast majority of them are not reported by the media. Unless you go to a court to read them all or they are big enough to hit the media in your area, you won't know about them.

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They are usually taken down first and blocked from coming back up.

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And not only that but, how many KJs do you know of who will openly admit to being sued for that (if confronted with the question)? On a slight tangent, I knew of a NY KJ who was named in one of SC's lawsuits (in one of their many sweeps 5 or 6 years ago), and when I asked him about it, he denied it to the hilt. I even told him that his name (his real name, not his business name) was mentioned in the document, and he still denied that it was him.

The KRG web site is still up and those guys were arrested for making homemade karaoke and sharing it on Torrent sites. They haven't added any new songs since their arrests but nothing has been taken down from the site since they were arrested. There are still hundreds of songs that you can download on their site.

Here is something I found when searching for a karaoke track by a company I had never heard of "Dancing Frog Karaoke":

Twas the night before Christmas, and all through the station, London police couldn’t give a figgy pudding about anybody’s plans for a homemade karaoke sing-along.

The City of London Police last week announced that they’d arrested three UK men who they said uploaded thousands of karaoke tracks online.

Police are calling them a “gang,” suspected as they are of uploading and distributing tens of thousands of tracks from artists including Beyonce, Lady Gaga, Kylie Minogue and Kanye West.

Head over to TorrentFreak and you’ll hear a bit of a different, less dramatic story: less of a criminal gang and more of a group of devoted karaoke fans, aged between 50 and 60, who made up their own DIY karaoke songs because the songs weren’t available from professional karaoke manufacturers.

Acting on a complaint filed by the British Phonographic Industry (BPI), City of London Police’s Intellectual Property Crime Unit (PIPCU) in June had initiated an investigation against individuals allegedly uploading karaoke tracks to the internet without permission.

Last Tuesday (15 December), they arrested one man in Barnstaple, Devon and two men in Bury, Lancashire.

Together the trio formed KaraokeRG (KRG), a release group specializing in karaoke tracks.

A company that makes and distributes karaoke music and products had noticed that KRG was uploading lots of tracks to the KickAss torrent website within days of the “legitimate” company having made them available on its own online platforms.

From the description at the top of KRG’s master list of songs on one of its sites:

The following is a list of all KaraokeRG homemade CD+G karaoke songs. They were created primarily because they are not available from any professional karaoke manufacturers. However, in some cases, some songs were made available by professional karaoke companies AFTER they were homemade.
In other words, KRG claimed to be filling a market gap with DIY karaoke titles otherwise not available.

But, as TorrentFreak says, it’s likely that the backing tracks are still subject to copyright restrictions, so giving them away, even with “homemade” subtitles, is still likely to get KRG into trouble.

The men’s homes were searched. Police seized computers, laptops and documents.

PIPCU estimates that “hundreds” of albums have had their copyright uploaded by the men, which has in turn led to “thousands and thousands of tracks being accessed illegally”, and that legitimate music companies have been deprived of a “significant” amount of money.

PIPCU’s Detective Constable Ceri Hunt:

The illegal downloading of copyrighted music may seem like a harmless thing to do, but the reality is that these individual offenses are collectively damaging one of our key creative industries, costing people who work in the music industry millions of pounds and threatening thousands of jobs.

PIPCU will continue to target the individuals and the organized crime gangs facilitating these crimes, working with key partners like the BPI to ensure that those most responsible are brought to justice.

PIPCU confirmed that the “karaoke gang” has been released on bail.

Dancing Frog Karaoke is just another guy working out of his basement making homemade karaoke tracks and trying to pass them off as professionally made legally licensed tracks. Similar to what many people claim that BKD does. If he makes a song that you want; buy it. What's the worst that could happen?

The torrent news sites portray KaraokeRG as a group of old men who just harmlessly create their own karaoke versions of must have songs that are unavailable and are being unfairly picked on by the law.
In truth, if you were to check the collection of what KaraokeRG has been distributing through torrents you would find that the homemade stuff is the smallest percentage of everything else they have offered up from almost every other producer.

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