Karaoke Forums

Since the audit process has been mentioned in every lawsuit and not one judge has made any statement saying that it was illegal or illegitimate, then I'd say it is, under the law, a proper business practice.

_________________
You can be strange but not a stranger

Just because no judge has commented on it directly doesn't imply that at all. In an area such as this with so many uncharted waters, judges, especially ones at lower levels, tend to shy away from making precedent-setting judgements, since there are levels above them that could potentially repeal their decision. Besides, I cannot see where anyone on the defensive end has argued any points in this direction. It might even take separate action to do so. We know that there is at least one significant player up in arms about it (the AZ Karaoke Alliance guy), and it might take someone highly invested like that to get that ball rolling...a judge certainly isn't going to initiate that kind of thing on his own...

You seem to think EVERYTHING is a proper business practice, whether it is unethical or not. That is a very unhealthy way to look at it, and half the reason why unemployment is so high, and corporate big wigs are living high on the hog while everyone else is scraping the bottom of the barrel.

HMmm, let me see how many more cliches I can fit in this post. .

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

It also appears to me that these lawsuits and this recent trial, with it's mistakes, has only empowered SC more against piracy. From mistakes made, SC readjusts to not create these mistakes again like any sane entity.

Also changing their terms as they go along should be perfectly legal, ie: audits begin 2010.

This recent trial I believe has got many running scared not to mention proving wrong those folks who had always been saying things like, "SC will never have one of these go to trial because they are afraid they will lose." Win or lose, SC has shown that they do have the balls to take it to trial!

"I can almost envision this getting to a point where someone calls into question the legitimacy of this whole "audit" process...just seems like the genesis of this process may be improperly conceived as a long-term model, and may even be an improper business practice...making up a policy that results in an additional cost to customers in this manner just begs for someone to call it into question..."

IF you read the judgements for the cases some have tried to use this "questioning of legitimacy" and it has been "shot down" in court. If you dont want to pay for audits SC(and CB before they closed) offers an option...play from original media. You only have to pay if you want the benefits of media-shiftting.

_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

From one manufacturer, none of the others have a problem with it. Don't use Sound Choice, problems solved. I don't have to shift All-Star, Pop Hits, EZ Hits and Sunfly, because, they come to me shifted for the format I want too use them. It's called the 20th Century.

well actually it's SC and DT/PR (was CB). See the recent AZ lawsuit against Tony G and his minions

All-star advises to purchase on disc for "professional use" but they do have a MP3 option available as does Stellar.

Overseas brands on discs if imported prior to the law change are legal and it does seem they dont care yet

_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

2 manufacturers in ALL of media entertainment. Not just in Karaoke but in ALL OF THE MUSIC BUSINESS. That what is so ridiculous about it. How long do you think people would have bought regular music CDs if they had to be audited to make sure they were at a 1:1 ratio when they shifted to computer.

The other thing that is really messed up is that you have to shift the tracks first, then get the audit. That means you have to infringe upon the trademark so they can come and charge you to audit you. The whole thing is ridiculous.

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

not exactly true Smoothedge....If you want to convert you can request an audit before you start to USE the HD and not have to infringe upon the trademark.

We are in process of starting to convert my grandson's system. If he gets any shows here in Florida he will use his discs until we can get him audited and certified. But yes, you do have to have the files on a HD for an audit to take place.

We are currently working on an additional system for ourselves too...It will be audited before it ever gets used either on disc or HD. No infringement there either

And yes it is only 2 in all of karaoke for now....why don't we look back in a couple of years and see if it is still only 2 ?

_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

in Canada you need a license to media shift. Its about $200/year last time I paid it *i haven't been a dj for several years*

It will still be two. The other companies won't want to make enemies out of their customers like SC has. There aren't too many people, in the grand scheme, that would put up with being audited by a vendor.

Athena, I like you very much, and I have mad respect for you, but I will never agree with you on this audit issue. I think they are going too far. It's not just pirates that are against SC and what they are doing. There are plenty, right here, on this forum who are not pirates who are against what SC is doing. If they continue to NOT take our concerns into consideration more and more people will stop using their products. It's a real shame.

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Smoothedge, I dont expect everyone to agree with me......I know that there are now and always will be people who disagree. I appreciate the respect that you show even when we dont agree
Bet you a dollar to a donut however that it will be more than 3 in 2 years...

_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

I don't think it will. I think in that same amount of time SC is going to have to back off. Either they will run out of money, or the climate will get too toxic. It will be no different than the RIAA lawsuits. They almost destroyed the music industry.

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

From what I understand from Timberlea, it doesn't cover karaoke tracks.

_________________
LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Read the quote because SmoothEdge is correct:

You are instructed by SC to infringe first, then request an audit.

Besides if you don't "use the HD" you've still made the copy and you then become a "technical infringer."

You want to split hairs from there, be my guest.

He DOES have a point. Just shifting the discs is an offense to SC. But Athena also has a point that if you haven't gone live with that HD you haven't done anything to get sued for. If you were to use those track just at home, while it is an infringement, who is going to enforce it?

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

infringement requires USE of the media-shifted tracks(check every single lawsuit filed to confirm this).....If do not use them you have not infringed...Hench the reason why my grandson(he is 9) will be using his discs if he has shows prior to his audit (as/after we convert his system)and why we will be getting the audit before we "go live" with the new system

_________________
"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

So who is doing the audits for Chartbuster, now??

_________________
I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

almost....it is only two IN THE ENTIRE MUSIC INDUSTRY.not just two in karaoke. no other entity in the music industry does this. they figured out that you make more money if you give people what they want. look at Stairway to Heaven, first billboard charting for that song was in 2007.....when they released it on digital download.

_________________
Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

Wait. Nine?

That's awesome and kind of interesting.

_________________
Co-host of The Greatest Song Ever Sung (Poorly), a karaoke-themed podcast