Karaoke Forums

i have a gemini preamp mixer/digital sampler/memory banks - model number
pdm-7024. 4 channel w/ master. when i use the eq the sound is much better. any suggetions on this. i am just testing out my equipment right now. a friend of mine says not to use the eq because it can cause problems with the cdgs pauseing. i have a gem sound amp and a pair of gemini speakers which can handle 200 watts max per speaker. the bar that i go to the kj is having this problem, he is using powered speakers if this helps, mackie speakers. kj and friend of mine are two differant people. looking for input on eq question

Just changing the EQ isn't going to have any direct effect on the CDG player at all. I assume what he means is that if you give the speakers too much bass and they are positioned in such a way that the bass waves are interacting with the CDG player then it could make it pause or skip.

This guy seems to be a bit on the amateur side, as it seems like this would be a simple problem to diagnose. If you don't want this to happen, just move the location of the speakers so they do not interact with your CDG player OR just limit the bass if moving the speakers is not possible or the bass is somehow reflecting back towards the player.

In 99.9% of setups, however, you should have your speakers placed AHEAD of your mixer and player and facing AWAY from the player, and unless the room is an acoustic nightmare, you should then be able to EQ all you want without your sound interacting at all with your mixer and player.

Shoot me back a quick post and let me know if I am right about this guy having his speakers BEHIND or at least very close to where he sets up his player.

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C Mc
KJ, FL

I agree with TOPHER on this one.  Thoes 2 are giving you realy BAD advice, espically the KJ,  he should know better.  The only thing that can casue a CDG player to stop working (other than a component inside it breaking) is a vibration, or bumping it.  If ya hit the CDG player it will skip/pause.  If you have a LOT of bass and it is directed twords the CDG player it can cause vibration thus making the CDG player skip/pause, just like if you hit it.

Like you said using your EQ greatly improves the sound, so stick with it, and you will sound better than thoes to.

Back in the day when I used CDs, I would occasionaly play at places with very bouncy floors.  Every time a few people jumped while dancing, the player would skip.  I would solve this by placing a folded towel under the player to cussion it.  99% of the time that would solve the problem.

Also with eq's you don't really want to boost frequencies if possible.  Most people use the classic 'smile' pattern where they boost both ends.  All this does is muddy up the vocals as most vocal frequencies are in that middle section that don't get raised.  Eq's are primarily used for tuning a room & getting rid of feedback areas - it can be used to change the sound of the speaker, but if you find you are needing to do this, you may want to consider upgrading your speakers &/or amps.

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Speaking of the smiley face...OMG, I can not belive how may systems I have seen set up this way.  I was talking about it with the wife one night (she started KJ 10+years ago) and was told when she started out by some "experts" and band sound techs that that is the way a EQ should be adjusted for "LIVE" music.

Yeah, it sounds like you are singing in a cardboard box.

Check out the pic of Lonman's system and note the EQ settings.  Just above and below 0 db....
http://www.karaoke-forum.com/download.php?id=1757

ANd don't do like lilDog does and adjust the EQ so they are all above 0 db, then you are just basically using the EQ as a amp.

The smiley comes from the old hi-fi days when the amps had a low frequency roll off and the speakers didnt have the tweaters they do now Plus the old folks need a high boost... So the lows and highs had to be boosted. Also the vol cntrls didnt have an audio taper so this was another reason for EQ..

 A poor system even now needs help on both ends,  hence the smiley

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The top eq is my stage monitor which is why the boost in the 80hz range, just a tad more bass - cheap speakers, but they work ok.  Most everything is flatlined as possible with minor cuts in the problematic or just bad sounding frequencies.

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Yeah but 10-15 years ago the Hi-Fi days????  At least I hope they weren't.

Im talkin maybe 40 years ago....

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TopherM , one speaker is on top of a arcade machine on its side, even with the equipment and no room for a speaker stand or to move forward. the other speaker is on a speaker stand slightly forward of the equipment and like i said these are mackie powered speakers and sound great when this doesnot happen. if i had to estimate how often  6 times in four hours.

Dunno....if the bass is not somehow interacting with the player to cause it to pause/skip, I couldn't tell you what else it would be. 99.9% of the time, that is it, but you may have found the 0.1%.

Next time you visit his bar, just place your hand on the CDG player while some music is playing and see if it doesn't vibrate along with the bass line from the music.

See, the thing is that your CDG player FEEDS a signal to the mixer, and the mixer does not feed a signal back to the player. It is a one-way street (I'm sure there are very low levels of cross-interference going back to the player, but it shouldn't be anywhere close to significant).

So basically, when you boost bands on the EQ, that boost in electrical power fed to that channel only has one direction to go -- to the amp, then the speakers, then it dissipates in the form of sound and heat into the room. Boosting the EQ doesn't send any sort of signal back to the player, thus in and of itself can not be causing the problem you described.

Bass is omni-directional, meaning it does not particularly go where your speaker is pointed. The majority is going to be focused in the direction the cone is facing, but percentages of the bass go in all directions, including behind the speaker (though this is a small amount of the overall output). Also, bass will bounce off of certain materials, like glass, wood, and concrete, and is absorbed by other materials, like carpet or clothing. So even if the speaker isn't FACING his CDG player, it could be too close to the CDG player so that the player is still interacting with bass waves that could cause the skip/pause. If it isn't the bass, I dunno what else it could be!!

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C Mc
KJ, FL