Karaoke Scene's Karaoke Forums
https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/

DISCONTINUED DISKS PROBLEM
https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=3812		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  kjchrisc [ Thu Jan 06, 2005 11:54 pm ]
Post subject:  DISCONTINUED DISKS PROBLEM
Hey there! Super-newbie-hot-off-registration! My girlfriend, (who I will now worship even more), recently bought me a brand new, unopened Sound Choice #8125- The Eagles Disk! :D After coming down from that emotional high, I started wondering what to do with this situation. This leads to the question: Is it legal to make a copy of a DISCONTINUED CDG for public performance? Being someone who believes in using only original cdg's for a show, I kinda feel guilty even asking question like this, but I'm not sure I want that particular CDG to even go out my front door for obvious reasons. If anyone has the answer to this, you will be my karaoke hero! If this "discontinued cdg" question has already been posted on the forum, can somebody let me know where it might be located in the archives? Thanks A Lot!!
Author:  karaokemeister [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 1:19 am ]
Post subject: 
Different stances in respect to the 'legal' aspect of this question have been made over the years and it's not real clear. I can tell you that the 'fair use' portion of USC Title 17 says:
"In determining whether the use made of a work in any particular case is a fair use the factors to be considered shall include —

(1) the purpose and character of the use, including whether such use is of a commercial nature or is for nonprofit educational purposes;

(2) the nature of the copyrighted work;

(3) the amount and substantiality of the portion used in relation to the copyrighted work as a whole; and

(4) the effect of the use upon the potential market for or value of the copyrighted work."

Generally accepted is the ability to back up something you own if not for commercial perposes. The thought is that if you own it you fulfill the final requirement of not impacting the market for the copyrighted material. Keep in mind I mean a legal copy of the copyrighted work produced with the permission of the copyright owner not the copyrighted material itself.

I've talked with Sound Choice's licensing group about this and using a PC to host a show and was told that as long as you can prove ownership of the original they will not press charges provided you don't make two copies for multiple rigs. In other words, if you own two karaoke rigs you need two sets of original discs.

Feels nice to get an 8125 for a present doesn't it? I got one myself for Christmas. :D And my disk won't be leaving the house either. 8)

BTW, anyone that wants to read up on 'fair use' and other copyright issues here are a few links:

http://fairuse.stanford.edu/
http://www.voiceoffreedom.com/fairuse.html

BTW, the Sony Corporation of America v. Universal City Studios case is known as the BetaMax decision and allows for time shifting of content.

http://www.hypernote.com/C65917043/E1919781329/
http://www.bearshare.net/printthread.ph ... ge=8&pp=20 (a discussion on bearshare's BB regarding copyright)
http://www.templetons.com/brad/copymyths.html

BTW, the Digital Millenium Copyright Act really changed some of these things up but it's getting torn to shreds in court by groups like the EEF.
http://www.eff.org/IP/DMCA/

It's a long response, but shorter than most of my posts on this subject in the past....

As always: I'm not a lawyer, I don't even play one on TV. Contact professional legal representation knowledgeable in the subject at hand for your best interest.
Author:  Tony [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 5:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: DISCONTINUED DISKS PROBLEM
kjchrisc wrote:
Is it legal to make a copy of a DISCONTINUED CDG for public performance? Being someone who believes in using only original cdg's for a show, I kinda feel guilty even asking question like this, but I'm not sure I want that particular CDG to even go out my front door for obvious reasons.


2 Things here kjchrisc. What KaraokeMeister says is true and worthwhile reading, but then again, you should use your own logic as well. You mentioned it to be a discontinued CD, now any one can kiss my grits if they think I will NOT make a copy with the original safely at home.

You have it all now. KaraokeMeister explained the law as quoted from different websites, and I've given you the logical point of view. Copy the disk and use it, but keep the original safely at home as proof of purchase.
Author:  Big Mike [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 6:43 am ]
Post subject: 
Don't know how long you've been in the biz, but when's the last time you had someone show up to check your discs at a show?

Anyone?
Author:  karaokemeister [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 7:27 am ]
Post subject: 
I haven't had anyone check my stuff.... but I'm still using all original discs at this point...

That will change soon enough and I'm sure someone, somewhere will ask me about it. But that 8125 won't leave the house any time soon (once it gets here - woohoo!)

Allstar, I like to quote the legal requirements because I want people to make up their own minds about what's right and wrong. If they don't agree with the law then they know they can call their congressman about it.

BTW, I'll be copying my 8125 the minute it shows up and putting it away in a safe place. They want to see it they can come back to my house to look at the original under glass behind a high voltage attack system. :wink:
Author:  Tony [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 8:37 am ]
Post subject: 
karaokemeister wrote:
Allstar, I like to quote the legal requirements because I want people to make up their own minds about what's right and wrong. If they don't agree with the law then they know they can call their congressman about it.
That's why I agreed!


karaokemeister wrote:
BTW, I'll be copying my 8125 the minute it shows up and putting it away in a safe place. They want to see it they can come back to my house to look at the original under glass behind a high voltage attack system. :wink:
:D
Author:  kjchrisc [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:18 am ]
Post subject: 
Good info. I'm sure the burned disk thing can get run into the ground, it's just that I've never seen any comments about the disks that were out of production-(I've "lurked" the site on occasion looking for info). Big Mike made a good point, because I've run karaoke over a decade, with originals, without noticing any cdg enforcement, swat team types. 8) Thanks for the site info and input Karaokemeister. You went above and beyond. :) Can probably make a backup with a bit more of a clear conscience, and it will probably be even easier once my girl gives in and finally tells me how much she paid for that disk! By the way, what is the recommended voltage for CDG security attack systems? :twisted:
Author:  Lonman [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 11:26 am ]
Post subject: 
kjchrisc wrote:
By the way, what is the recommended voltage for CDG security attack systems? :twisted:


If it's enough to hurt - that's bad!
If it's enough to kill - that's good! :twisted:
Author:  SwingcatKurt [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 1:04 pm ]
Post subject: 
Be careful of TASER-OKE discs!
Author:  karaokemeister [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:52 pm ]
Post subject: 
If it's the disc I think it is I know what she paid for it. :D And it's the fair going price for that disc, about what I paid for it.

BTW, there was another one that sold recently at about $40 less than market value but I didn't pick it up since mine is already on it's way.
Author:  Lonman [ Fri Jan 07, 2005 3:54 pm ]
Post subject: 
karaokemeister wrote:
If it's the disc I think it is I know what she paid for it. :D And it's the fair going price for that disc, about what I paid for it.

BTW, there was another one that sold recently at about $40 less than market value but I didn't pick it up since mine is already on it's way.


8125 goes for about $200-$400 when you can find them.
Page 1 of 1 All times are UTC - 8 hours
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
https://www.phpbb.com/