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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:10 am 
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Legal downloads!

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:36 am 
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The entire karaoke world will be owned and controlled by lawyers having never made a single contribution to the making of the music we love.

And before Obama leaves office he will give all involved in a lawsuit a pardon on copyrights infringements, and their children in the future. We need to level the playing field, and this would only take from those disgustingly rich capitalists.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 11:58 am 
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I don't the next 5 years will change much for Karaoke Hosts.

Hosts will still buy and rip discs because that is the cheapest means of acquiring music (short or pirating it)
Hosts will still buy and use downloads though probably in greater numbers as (good) discs become a little more scarce.
Hosts will still stream if they are happy with it.
Pirates will still pirate.

There *might* be some change above us at the distributor and production level, but that doesn't and really shouldn't concern us so long as we can continue to obtain music in the formats we use at a price that is reasonable.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 1:04 pm 
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I see legal hosts downsizing their collection, picking and choosing one or two karaoke manufacturers as they have to pay for licensing for every line they would own.

I see smaller KJs getting priced out of the market, while larger companies that can absorb the costs grow and then get better money because there is less competition from said little hosts.

I still see lots of pirates still as they won't advertise where they are, have a web page, etc. Maybe they change from public venues to private ones because spotters can't get invited to little Johnny's 5th birthday party.

I see venues getting sued, and after they absorb THAT getting rid of karaoke for Trivia or some new fad.

I am a VERY negative/pessimistic person... can you tell?

I love my job, and I am watching all these events unfold very carefully. I'm close to retiring soon anyway... just depends on what crazy stuff goes on that will set the time frame.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 5:48 pm 
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KjAthena1 wrote:
A very real possibility .... still prefer discs however due to ability to resell

Already coming. Karaoke.net is offering fully licensed downloads for kj use in US! Over 20000 tracks available with Party Tyme, Pocket Songs rebranded as Party Tyme and Tropical Zone brands for Spanish. They also take requests and are already making requests from this board as well. No flashy dj will be able to deny downloads are illegal to use in shows anymore since these are fully legal to use in shows!

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Sun Oct 25, 2015 6:44 pm 
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If you havent heard the new samples of upcoming releases they are better than ok.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 12:23 am 
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KjAthena1 wrote:
I am all for as many US publishers as possible producing....I also just ordered the 6SCDG set of Latin music to help pump up our Tampa shows....PartyTyme is OK.

SCDGs?? REALLY?? Are they properly licensed?? Did you get the proper information??

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 5:57 am 
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KjAthena1 wrote:
Yes per the publishers the Tropical Zone SCDG's are licensed properly...and yes I have listened to the previews and they sound decent as I said I just prefer DISCS in my hands for resale and want it for the lowest price possible....why would I spend more $$$ to buy Tropic Zone from PartyTyme when I can legally buy from Tropic Zone directly ? I also am not a fan of "Family Friendly" versions of tracks as they tick of our customers....if a track is that foul it is just coded for non play in family venues

Again as I stated I want as many US producers up and running as possible.....that is good for the karaoke business.

Just so you know, SC acquiring CB does NOT mean Chartbuster is up and running. They have ONLY acquired the trademark so they can sue more people. Digitrax still owns the product.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 6:17 am 
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Smoothedge69 wrote:
Just so you know, SC acquiring CB does NOT mean Chartbuster is up and running. They have ONLY acquired the trademark so they can sue more people. Digitrax still owns the product.


We have plenty of people to sue under the SC trademark. Enforcing the CB brand won't change the number of pirates we sue. It will ensure that the number 2 American brand (in terms of actual plays) won't become freeware.

Our purpose in acquiring the CB brand is to ensure the continuity of the brand so that it remains enforceable. We will be producing new material under that brand, although it will not be focused on the professional market (even though it will be available to that market for KJs who have a need for what we produce). There is a robust market for non-professional uses that includes plenty of material that we can sell profitably. CB will be used primarily for that purpose--but those uses will also make it possible for us to enforce the brand in the professional market and thus prevent it from falling into the freeware status that several brands have become.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 6:36 am 
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JimHarrington wrote:
Smoothedge69 wrote:
Just so you know, SC acquiring CB does NOT mean Chartbuster is up and running. They have ONLY acquired the trademark so they can sue more people. Digitrax still owns the product.


We have plenty of people to sue under the SC trademark. Enforcing the CB brand won't change the number of pirates we sue. It will ensure that the number 2 American brand (in terms of actual plays) won't become freeware.

Our purpose in acquiring the CB brand is to ensure the continuity of the brand so that it remains enforceable. We will be producing new material under that brand, although it will not be focused on the professional market (even though it will be available to that market for KJs who have a need for what we produce). There is a robust market for non-professional uses that includes plenty of material that we can sell profitably. CB will be used primarily for that purpose--but those uses will also make it possible for us to enforce the brand in the professional market and thus prevent it from falling into the freeware status that several brands have become.

Jim, you can use all the flowery language you want. You are out to sue more people. Bottom line. Everyone here knows it. You are going to try to make money of those who have purchased the product in the past, just as you have with the SC brand. Stop telling stories. I don't really care, cause I am not a CB user. I get my Country from SBI.

But I am sure that if you do anything relevant, and offer it for download, I will buy it. That being said, though, if I get bothered even ONCE by your people, I will drop the brand like a bad case of fleas!! I will tell every KJ I know to stay away from it. Simple as that. Same goes for any SC you might make available. I buy from the companies that don't hassle their customers, and try to make them jump through hoops. I have enough to think about in this endeavor, between keeping the equipment running, (since I fix my own stuff), and doing my own books, and cataloging the music I buy, and computer maintenance, and running a quality show no matter how I feel, or what my mood is. I don't need the added headache of dealing with Karaoke peddlers. Just provide the songs, let me buy them, and stay the HELL out of my business. Simple.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 6:41 am 
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JimHarrington wrote:
We have plenty of people to sue under the SC trademark. Enforcing the CB brand won't change the number of pirates we sue. It will ensure that the number 2 American brand (in terms of actual plays) won't become freeware.

Our purpose in acquiring the CB brand is to ensure the continuity of the brand so that it remains enforceable.

And what's in it for you? A nice commission percentage of settlements you can shakedown out of venues? Or are you simply concerned that your trademark will be diminished and replaced because huge amount of cheap discs they've been dumping on the market for the last couple years?

No need to continue the fib either, you're not interested in suing pirates, your main focus now is suing venues for settlements and then "technical infringers" and hopefully, there will be a pirate or two in the net as well. Your refusal over the years to sue ANY of the "reported pirates" that KJ's have pointed out to you is indicative of your true motives.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 8:09 am 
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KjAthena1 wrote:
Yes per the publishers the Tropical Zone SCDG's are licensed properly...and yes I have listened to the previews and they sound decent as I said I just prefer DISCS in my hands for resale and want it for the lowest price possible....why would I spend more $$$ to buy Tropic Zone from PartyTyme when I can legally buy from Tropic Zone directly ? I also am not a fan of "Family Friendly" versions of tracks as they tick of our customers....if a track is that foul it is just coded for non play in family venues

Again as I stated I want as many US producers up and running as possible.....that is good for the karaoke business.



Didn't reselling get you in some hot water recently?

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 8:20 am 
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Smoothedge69 wrote:
Jim, you can use all the flowery language you want. You are out to sue more people. Bottom line. Everyone here knows it. You are going to try to make money of those who have purchased the product in the past, just as you have with the SC brand. Stop telling stories. I don't really care, cause I am not a CB user. I get my Country from SBI.


How on earth could we possibly make money from people who have purchased CB in the past? Those are exactly the people we don't want to make money from.

We are interested in making money from the people who use CB tracks without having bought them.

Smoothedge69 wrote:
But I am sure that if you do anything relevant, and offer it for download, I will buy it. That being said, though, if I get bothered even ONCE by your people, I will drop the brand like a bad case of fleas!! I will tell every KJ I know to stay away from it. Simple as that. Same goes for any SC you might make available. I buy from the companies that don't hassle their customers, and try to make them jump through hoops. I have enough to think about in this endeavor, between keeping the equipment running, (since I fix my own stuff), and doing my own books, and cataloging the music I buy, and computer maintenance, and running a quality show no matter how I feel, or what my mood is. I don't need the added headache of dealing with Karaoke peddlers. Just provide the songs, let me buy them, and stay the HELL out of my business. Simple.


A serious question: How many times have we ever "hassled" you or your business?


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 8:51 am 
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atty Harrington wrote:
We are interested in making money from the people who use CB tracks without having bought them.
Not entirely true. You don't have a problem suing anyone who uses the tracks and refuses to pay you a fee to show you a receipt.
Even if the tracks they are playing came off a 12,000 song hard drive or an SD card and are intended to be played off a computer.

You are simply suing venues and KJ's "because they have stuff" with no reasonable excuse other than to collect a fee. It's what you do and it's currently ALL you do.

So, when are you going to update your "advance" customers like you promised and tell them how many subscribers you have? Or do you feel that since you're holding their money, you don't have to? Time is running out....

As someone I respect greatly in this business said recently; "I'll bet they put out a few public domain songs so they won't have to refund anyone."


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 9:07 am 
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JimHarrington wrote:
Smoothedge69 wrote:
Just so you know, SC acquiring CB does NOT mean Chartbuster is up and running. They have ONLY acquired the trademark so they can sue more people. Digitrax still owns the product.


We have plenty of people to sue under the SC trademark. Enforcing the CB brand won't change the number of pirates we sue. It will ensure that the number 2 American brand (in terms of actual plays) won't become freeware.

Our purpose in acquiring the CB brand is to ensure the continuity of the brand so that it remains enforceable. We will be producing new material under that brand, although it will not be focused on the professional market (even though it will be available to that market for KJs who have a need for what we produce). There is a robust market for non-professional uses that includes plenty of material that we can sell profitably. CB will be used primarily for that purpose--but those uses will also make it possible for us to enforce the brand in the professional market and thus prevent it from falling into the freeware status that several brands have become.


Of COURSE your going to ensure that CB doesn't become freeware! Because then people will have zero use for SC product (Essentials 1-10 = 4500 unique songs and would be equal to the GEM series for a LOT less), turning to CB to fill their basics over SC. You are going to make the CB brand "Enforceable", how so? In wonderful 1920's Chicago gangland style? No, you are going to SUE people over use of the CB trademark. After all with if SC is #1 and CB is #2, you have a LOT of venues find and "enforce".

At least when it comes to your defense of Sound Choice, I am OK with it. You had everything to do with the product, you never made digital product, only regular CDs and some customs ones. I can understand the anger of being ripped off by pirates when people should be paying for your products, watching the company go through reductions and seeing a good company fall. Losing SC product for me sucked... It was my go-to line. I still feel like your hurting KJs who have supported you over the years, but I understand your issues in dealing with the industry. My only hope is that you are fair with those people who prove they were never your enemy, and you can repair that damage after you hit them with a lawsuit.

But ChartBuster... that's a whole different ball game. You had nothing to do with it other then to acquire the logo. You never made or owned the karaoke tracks, never spent one day getting licensing for the product, or producing it, you only have bought a trademark. We all know how you enforce the SC trademark, and we all expect you do do exactly the same thing here with the CB one. With the CB logo, your business just in it for the take: Shakedowns, more licensing, more fees to karaoke DJs.

It's very sad that your company has become all about lawsuits and less about music. You might as well just make public domain and children's songs under the Sound Choice banner too, this way you can focus on purely on your real work with lawsuits. This move to get just the CB logo makes it all the more obvious of your future intent.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:05 am 
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KjAthena1 wrote:
Yes per the publishers the Tropical Zone SCDG's are licensed properly...and yes I have listened to the previews and they sound decent as I said I just prefer DISCS in my hands for resale and want it for the lowest price possible....why would I spend more $$$ to buy Tropic Zone from PartyTyme when I can legally buy from Tropic Zone directly ? I also am not a fan of "Family Friendly" versions of tracks as they tick of our customers....if a track is that foul it is just coded for non play in family venues

Um, the parent company of Party Tyme OWN Tropical Zone as well just FYI, along with Pocket Songs which is why they will be offering those brands - all licensed for full kj commercial use in the USA in pure digital download form (which I remember a few kj's saying THAT would NEVER happen). Also they will be offering custom 'discs' as well for those that want them.

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:40 am 
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Toastedmuffin wrote:
It's very sad that your company has become all about lawsuits and less about music. You might as well just make public domain and children's songs under the Sound Choice banner too, this way you can focus on purely on your real work with lawsuits. This move to get just the CB logo makes it all the more obvious of your future intent.


:clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper:

Exactly. And they just might make some public domain and children's songs.... for their advance customers... that way, they won't have to refund anything.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 10:46 am 
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c. staley wrote:
Toastedmuffin wrote:
It's very sad that your company has become all about lawsuits and less about music. You might as well just make public domain and children's songs under the Sound Choice banner too, this way you can focus on purely on your real work with lawsuits. This move to get just the CB logo makes it all the more obvious of your future intent.


:clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper:

Exactly. And they just might make some public domain and children's songs.... for their advance customers... that way, they won't have to refund anything.


This is the very definition of FUD......

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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:01 am 
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chrisavis wrote:
c. staley wrote:
Toastedmuffin wrote:
It's very sad that your company has become all about lawsuits and less about music. You might as well just make public domain and children's songs under the Sound Choice banner too, this way you can focus on purely on your real work with lawsuits. This move to get just the CB logo makes it all the more obvious of your future intent.


:clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper: :clapper:

Exactly. And they just might make some public domain and children's songs.... for their advance customers... that way, they won't have to refund anything.


This is the very definition of FUD......


From the website:

What kind of music will be produced?
We try to choose music that's popular and singable and that has staying power. We will consider almost any genre, from rock to metal to pop to country. Since we haven't produced anything for nearly six years, we want to focus on more recent material, but we will consider producing older music that hasn't been done for karaoke before. We will not be duplicating any previously released SOUND CHOICE® titles. We're going to take input from you on what to include, so the best way to influence what's on the disc will be to sign up.


We will not be offering public domain or children's material to fulfill the ADVANCE obligation.

I'll say at this point that we are probably not going to make the goal. Licensing is taking longer than expected as well. The response hasn't been what we'd hoped, but we gave it a shot, and we'll find another way to make it happen. If we miss the goal, we'll do one of three things: Kick in the rest of production costs from our funds, simply refund the money, or offer you a choice to get a refund or get credits to use later on new production. If we offer the choice, we'll probably offer 10 or 12 credits (or the equivalent; depends on how our credit system ends up working) for the $30. Regardless, if we decide not to kick in production costs, you'll definitely have the option of a full refund.


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 Post subject: Re: Im BACK...wondering
PostPosted: Mon Oct 26, 2015 11:35 am 
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JimHarrington wrote:
From the website:

What kind of music will be produced?
We try to choose music that's popular and singable and that has staying power. We will consider almost any genre, from rock to metal to pop to country. Since we haven't produced anything for nearly six years, we want to focus on more recent material, but we will consider producing older music that hasn't been done for karaoke before. We will not be duplicating any previously released SOUND CHOICE® titles. We're going to take input from you on what to include, so the best way to influence what's on the disc will be to sign up.


We will not be offering public domain or children's material to fulfill the ADVANCE obligation.

I'll say at this point that we are probably not going to make the goal. Licensing is taking longer than expected as well. The response hasn't been what we'd hoped, but we gave it a shot, and we'll find another way to make it happen. If we miss the goal, we'll do one of three things: Kick in the rest of production costs from our funds, simply refund the money, or offer you a choice to get a refund or get credits to use later on new production. If we offer the choice, we'll probably offer 10 or 12 credits (or the equivalent; depends on how our credit system ends up working) for the $30. Regardless, if we decide not to kick in production costs, you'll definitely have the option of a full refund.

Based on the tentative list you provided to us at the beginning of this month, maybe you should have PEP/SC focus more on the statement I highlighted in RED. Please note, the key words Sound Choice (SC) do NOT appear in that sentence, and PEP/SC should truly consider basing their intent to start producing again on that statement. Maybe you should take a look at some of our song suggestions in the other topic threads.


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