Karaoke Scene's Karaoke Forums https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/ |
|
Any KDHs left out there? https://mail.karaokescene.net/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=28579 |
Page 1 of 3 |
Author: | JoeChartreuse [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 12:41 am ] |
Post subject: | Any KDHs left out there? |
KDH stands for Karaoke Dork Host. These are hosts that actually believe they should be hired and paid for simply entertaining regulars who would be at the venue whether they were there or not. They actually don't believe they should be generating new income for the venue. They think that- though generating nothing, thus adding an actual EXPENSE to the venue- even though the bar has no REASON to pay them, since they are non-productive- they should be paid anyway. Any left here? |
Author: | Lonman [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 1:39 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
I guess I would fall 'somewhat' into that category. Our bar has let themself go down to the point that many regulars have left due to bartender changes (customers claiming underpouring), that the only ones that DO come in are coming in strictly because I am there. If not, they'd be wherever else I would be (which they have stated). However on the flip side I still believe in trying to generate new business in any manner possible, so in that respect, no I don't fit. I am the first one to admit that the days of following a host are long gone simply because there are so many other options anymore. But there are some that still follow particular hosts for one reason or another - beit sound system quality, they have (or will get) the songs they want to sing, or simply they like the host and will follow them (again rare anymore). |
Author: | TopherM [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 6:57 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
The weekly "bar regulars" actually typically hate my show. I even had a dragout about a year ago with a daytime bartender who was telling all the bar regulars to leave everytime I walked in the door. I went through the proper channels and told the owner she was basically telling his customers to leave, but he didn't do anything about it so I confronted her myself, and she hasn't done it since. Anyway, the "bar regulars" at my bar are pretty much the lowest of the low scumbag drunks, so I certainly don't particularly even want them at my show, and certainly don't cater to them. I'm much more concerned with my karaoke regulars, and the two groups rarely intermingle. As far as that goes, the karaoke regulars eb and wane over time. Sometimes there's like 30-40 of them including the singers and non-singers, sometimes less, and big chunks of them seem to turnover and become new people about every 1.5 years or so. People have babies, people get married, people stop drinking/smoking, people lose jobs.....life just changes where you don't go to karaoke every week anymore. Either way, in the grand scheme of things, I don't really organically grow attendence to my show, but I pretty much maintain it, and seem to always replace defectors with new attendees. If anything, mmy average attendence is down about 10-15% from 2002-2004 levels, but I still cost much less than I generate for the bar, which should be every KJ and bar owner's main concern. |
Author: | chrisavis [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:02 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
I agree with Lonnie. Twenty years ago I would follow a host 20 miles across town. With piracy and over-saturation making 500,000 songs available on every corner, it is hard to justify driving past 10 other places that provide karaoke to a place that has a host I like. I am sure it is different in smaller towns though. There is only one host I ever go out of my way for and I have gone out of my way for him since I started singing. But he is more than a host, he is a long time friend. Every time o go back home to Texas, I let him know I coming and we both send out blasts to friends to coordinate. That said, when ever I announce that I will be taking a night off and will have someone covering for me, I know the crowd changes. Regulars will stay home and whoever is covering for me will draw different faces. But it isn't like their entire crew follows them across town. I think the problem you mention is more of an issue with places that offer karaoke 4-7 nights a week and/or those that have done so for a very long time. There are places know as "karaoke bars" and there are places known as "bars that also have karaoke". My wife (my marketing director) spends a couple hours a week putting together social media advertising for every place I work. I run print ads. I am even considering doing some (yuck!) contests. I know my role and know that I have to provide value to ensure my longevity. The bars have to at least feel they will make more money with me there then without me. -Chris -Chris |
Author: | leopard lizard [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 7:18 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
I think it has to be a team approach. I don't expect the bar to do all of the work and then I just show up. But it doesn't work any better when the bar expects that I will do all of the work while they sit back waiting for a miracle. Although I may be working for a venue it is still my own separate business so I promote it not just to bar owners but to the patrons. But I can't do magic if a bar is clueless and is just throwing karaoke hosts at the wall hoping something will stick. The bar has to have a plan for attracting and keeping patrons, too, and ideally both parties would be sharing strategies. |
Author: | JoeChartreuse [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:15 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
Lonman wrote: I guess I would fall 'somewhat' into that category. Our bar has let themself go down to the point that many regulars have left due to bartender changes (customers claiming underpouring), that the only ones that DO come in are coming in strictly because I am there. If not, they'd be wherever else I would be (which they have stated). However on the flip side I still believe in trying to generate new business in any manner possible, so in that respect, no I don't fit. I am the first one to admit that the days of following a host are long gone simply because there are so many other options anymore. But there are some that still follow particular hosts for one reason or another - beit sound system quality, they have (or will get) the songs they want to sing, or simply they like the host and will follow them (again rare anymore). First and foremost, you do NOT fit into that category, per the emboldened part of your post above. YOU are generating the income, and thus are deserving of the job and it's compensation. However- and lucky for me- the days of host following are NOT over, other options be damned. MANY singers still follow hosts. Yes, some for sound or selection or whatever- but most ( in my personal experience) follow the host that makes them feel most comfortable, most important and wanted, most like they count. |
Author: | JoeChartreuse [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:27 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
TopherM wrote: Either way, in the grand scheme of things, I don't really organically grow attendence to my show, but I pretty much maintain it, and seem to always replace defectors with new attendees. If anything, mmy average attendence is down about 10-15% from 2002-2004 levels, but I still cost much less than I generate for the bar, which should be every KJ and bar owner's main concern. Same for you, Topher- not of the category described. I wasn't asking how the show was doing, but rather was commenting on attitude. You have brought in customers, and when some move on, you replace them. You ARE bringing income into the venue. What I am referring to are those KJs ( not Karaoke Hosts) who feel they should get paid to press play, and don't feel they should have to generate more income- not only to cover their pay, but to add profits for the venue. Having been a bar owner myself, I have seen both sides. As an owner, if a KJ comes in but doesn't bring in any business above and beyond the regulars that would be there whether the KJ was there or not, then said KJ is not only useless, but a negative (cost) to the venue, because I am paying them for nothing. |
Author: | JoeChartreuse [ Tue Sep 03, 2013 11:30 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
leopard lizard wrote: I think it has to be a team approach. I don't expect the bar to do all of the work and then I just show up. But it doesn't work any better when the bar expects that I will do all of the work while they sit back waiting for a miracle. Although I may be working for a venue it is still my own separate business so I promote it not just to bar owners but to the patrons. But I can't do magic if a bar is clueless and is just throwing karaoke hosts at the wall hoping something will stick. The bar has to have a plan for attracting and keeping patrons, too, and ideally both parties would be sharing strategies. Correct on all counts, Mimi. Of course, in an ideal situation the bar promotes at LEAST as much as the KJ- hell, it's THEM making the profits. However, whether a bar promotes or not, it's our job to promote OUR BUSINESS. that's WHY we get paid. |
Author: | mrmarog [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:17 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
When I gig I take tons of photos of singers and listeners. If they are new I get their email and send them a personal email thanking them for their support. I like to give groups of people (birthday, anniversary, promotions, etc) special attention. The place I host at the most gives me (not the other hosts) $50 more for this service. |
Author: | TopherM [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 5:58 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
Quote: What I am referring to are those KJs ( not Karaoke Hosts) who feel they should get paid to press play, and don't feel they should have to generate more income- not only to cover their pay, but to add profits for the venue. I wouldn't put that on the KJ. I'd put that on the owner/manager. There are definitely plenty of disorganized or complacent owners that don't understand how the KJ contributes to the bottom line. If the KJ can stay there 5-10 years doing minimal work and the owner/manager doesn't care, why should the KJ care? On the flip side, I've seen plenty of really good KJs that do a really good job and bring in good business that the owners/managers refuse to pay a proper wage. Like I said in my last post, when both the bar and the KJ are happy with the money they are making, then you have a good show. You really can't have one without the other. |
Author: | SwingcatKurt [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:32 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
I don't go to Lonnie's gig at the T-Bird to go see bartenders. I go to hang out with LONNIE!! But then, I'm driving from Portland, Ore to Tacoma, Wa....about 130 miles. Now THAT'S A FOLLOWING!! |
Author: | SwingcatKurt [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 9:44 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
It"s all about KEEPING BUTTS IN THE SEATS. Our job as KJ/DJ's is to keep the crowds engaged having fun, dancing, singing, chattering, getting sweaty and thirsty AND BUYING MORE DRINKS. If you can't do those basic things, then the crowd will disappear by 11pm losing BIG CHUNKS OF REVENUE for the bar. As to bringing crowds, no matter now much Facebook, paper ads etc, you do, you alone can only do so much. If the bar itself does not have a built in crowd and reputation for being a "COOL" place to be and has all the things associated with that (Excellent customer service, friendly bar staff, good prices, good food and drinks, safe and clean setting) then you will not hold a crowd ALL EVENING LONG(like for 5 hours) no matter how hard YOU TRY, and the bar will lose big money and eventually fail. You can only do so much and you alone CANNOT SAVE a failing bar that does not make the effort to meet these minimums. |
Author: | Smoothedge69 [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 1:06 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
SwingcatKurt wrote: It"s all about KEEPING BUTTS IN THE SEATS. Our job as KJ/DJ's is to keep the crowds engaged having fun, dancing, singing, chattering, getting sweaty and thirsty AND BUYING MORE DRINKS. If you can't do those basic things, then the crowd will disappear by 11pm losing BIG CHUNKS OF REVENUE for the bar. As to bringing crowds, no matter now much Facebook, paper ads etc, you do, you alone can only do so much. If the bar itself does not have a built in crowd and reputation for being a "COOL" place to be and has all the things associated with that (Excellent customer service, friendly bar staff, good prices, good food and drinks, safe and clean setting) then you will not hold a crowd ALL EVENING LONG(like for 5 hours) no matter how hard YOU TRY, and the bar will lose big money and eventually fail. You can only do so much and you alone CANNOT SAVE a failing bar that does not make the effort to meet these minimums. I have that problem with the place I am at. The people that do come stay all night, but getting new people in the place is hard because it has a bad reputation as does it's owners. Then they just let a bartender go, so she took her friends with her. Also, our town has an overzealous police force who like to make arrests, so people are afraid to drive here. So bringing in new people is hard for that reason, too. I have a lot of friends in Venice who just won't chance driving in North Port. The Friday before Labor Day was absolutely dead. I had 3 singers the whole night. I later found out everyplace was dead, around here. It was all because of the cops. It's annoying, to say the least. It's really not a bad place. It's got a nice intimate atmosphere, because it is small. They offer drink specials, and the remaining bartenders are quite good. |
Author: | JoeChartreuse [ Wed Sep 04, 2013 11:29 pm ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
" I like to give groups of people (birthday, anniversary, promotions, etc) special attention. The place I host at the most gives me (not the other hosts) $50 more for this service." Yup, A BIGGIE- whether the host gets paid for it or not. All about customer service, and showing patrons that they are important. |
Author: | timberlea [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 4:59 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
"Also, our town has an overzealous police force who like to make arrests, so people are afraid to drive here." Always someone else's fault. I guess people there haven't heard of taxis or designated drivers. |
Author: | mrmarog [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 6:37 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
timberlea wrote: Smooth wrote:"Also, our town has an overzealous police force who like to make arrests, so people are afraid to drive here." Always someone else's fault. I guess people there haven't heard of taxis or designated drivers. Timberlea: Is it difficult to sleep at night with your halo and angel wings? |
Author: | chrisavis [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 6:48 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
timberlea wrote: "Also, our town has an overzealous police force who like to make arrests, so people are afraid to drive here." Always someone else's fault. I guess people there haven't heard of taxis or designated drivers. Taxi's cost money, and designated drivers don't always live conveniently close to those being driven. That isn't anyone's "fault". That is just reality. -Chris |
Author: | leopard lizard [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:12 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
Have to agree with Smooth on this one as I was at a venue that experienced the same thing. The Sheriff would park across the street and wait and it was very intimidating to people. It was a rural area with no taxi service. Some people lived close enough to walk and even they got questioned. One fellow had decided to walk across the street to a casino so he could have coffee and hang out a while before he drove and he was stopped and questioned. He thought he was doing the right thing. The bartender used to walk home and she was stopped because she was carrying a bottled water. One patron was stopped for walking and told that anyone out at night with a flashlight was under suspicion of being a possible burglar and that she would be stopped any time she did that. Another of the bartender's was stopped 6 times while driving home. She filed a complaint and the Sheriff started waiting for her to leave at night. The car would circle the bar at closing time. It had a chilling effect on attendance. Even people who weren't going to be drinking and driving lost the party mood because they "felt like Mom was watching them." I once lived in a community where the Sheriff's were very aggressive on stopping people. I would be coming home from work late at night (not bar work) and get pulled over--the little light on the license plate, etc. It got to the point where I started thinking twice about driving at night at all. The lights flashing behind you are always an adrenaline rush and it just got too uncomfortable to experience that over and over and then start anticipating that fear every time I drove. At the time I moved people were writing to the paper about it and demanding fix it tickets to document the reason they were pulled over--and they weren't getting them. I moved so I'm not sure how that came out. But if I could feel nervous about just going to the store at night, imagine the effect that would have on bar attendance. |
Author: | SwingcatKurt [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 7:31 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
Does this bar have a history of incidents with bar fights, complaints, disturbances, gang activity, et al? That will CERTAINLY provoke high police profile as you describe. |
Author: | leopard lizard [ Thu Sep 05, 2013 8:20 am ] |
Post subject: | Re: Any KDHs left out there? |
There were no gangs and fights were a rarity. It was a small town, rural neighborhood dive populated by locals. |
Page 1 of 3 | All times are UTC - 8 hours |
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group https://www.phpbb.com/ |