Karaoke Forums

Hey Y'all, I found this forum and am sooooooooo glad it is here for people like me. My friend and I are wanting to start a karaoke/dj business and we have about 2000.00 to work with. I know, I know, it's not much, but it's what we got. Here's the thing. We don't know Jack Squat about mixers or ohms or anything like that, so I am trying to decide on the best equipment for the money. We will be playing smaller clubs as we live in the country so it's basically a bunch of taverns and honkey tonks but occasionally we will be doing outdoor live events but it would only be to accomodate maybe 100 or so people and that won't be til next summer. So far I have narrowed it down to this:

1.CAVS 202G Player - 399.99 - that comes with 2000 songs
2. Mackie DFX12 Mixer - 239.95 (based on all posts by the senior member of this forum)
3. Speakers ??????
This is due to the fact that I don't really know what in the hell I need other than 15" with subwoofers- I did read posts by other folks, but I need to know if the mixer I get is compatible to the speakers ( I don't know how to figure out the conversion - I warned you I was an idioit)- I don't want to blow them out in a matter of months
4. Sonic Maximizer - Do I really need this?
5. Monitor - was wondering if a 12" computer lcd monitor would work in which case I have and if so, what kind of cables do I need and where would it go?
6. Defiantely going with the shure sm58 -200.00 (2)
7. Speaker Stands, Cables, Etc - estimated $250.00

So that leaves me at $1089.94

OK, Other than the speakers, does this setup sound ok? If not, could somebody please help me

Also have a question about dual disc changer, I was reading on another website that this dude has a single tray machine but he got a dual disc changer at Circut City and uses that. Is this very important? And how would a person go about hooking that in, specifically what would a girl need in terms of cable and all?

Thanks in advance. I mean THANKS A LOT!!

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The best reason for having dreams is that in dreams no reasons are necessary

gurlgeek, first of all, a hearty welcome! We are glad you found us, and hope you stay!

Now to the business. Technical questions are very personal, so you will find 1000's of answers. People like Lonman and Knightshow are the sound guru's here, and even though I might not always agree, I have a great deal of respect for them.

The Mackie as mixer is a very good choice, speakers are a never ending debate, and I have opted for the powered JBL's for various reasons. The mic's are debatable but Shure SM58's are a very good choice. The sonic maximizer is a very nice add-on, and if you don't buy it now, you'll probably buy it next week . The 12" computer lcd monitor is a good choice if you use PC based hosting, otherwise stick to a cheap little TV and you won't have the drama and additional obscure cables and converters.

Now I'll through a stick in your wheel. Seeing that you are starting, why not start with PC based hosting, using software created by MTU, called Hoster? I had the JVC player (and carrycases with disks, including all the added dust, scratching of disks, occasional dirty disk that would go whacky at a critical point) then switched to PC based hosting, and that's the way to go!!!! I'll never go back to the player option.

I'll probably get some flack for my input here, but at the end of the day, you'll have to make the choice between all the information you gather. Good luck!!!

Where can I find out more about PC based hosting and what do you recommend? Is it hard to do as opposed to the traditional style? Pro's and cons of that?

Sorry but I am grrrrr HUNGRY for all information on this!!

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The best reason for having dreams is that in dreams no reasons are necessary

I'm just learning myself, but I'll add in a little on the PC hosting.

PC hosting requires that you 'rip' the CD's to a format suitable for playing on the computer. Typically, this is MP3+CDG (two files) or WMA+CDG. Each of these has an audio file for the sound playback portion and a CDG file that contains the timing and word information. PC hosting has it's advantages and the SCDG's that you're likely getting with the CAVS 202G player will play on a PC - but might take longer to cue up, etc. I'm assuming the songs are probably the Chartbuster Series - Vols 1-4 on SCDG.

For powered speakers listen to Lonman. He's made some recommendations for me recently and I'm still looking around but the recommendations he's made seem to be spot on in quality and bang for the buck.

Couple things to remember since you have a limited budget. Sometimes it's ok to spend just a little less and get a slightly lesser quality product that will last if you don't know how long this 'venture' will go for. I'd consider possibly using a slightly cheaper mic and buying more (you'll want one for the kj to announce with, and at least two for the singers - duets). While the Shure SM58 is a great mic, I've had good luck with the Fender P-51 mic that comes with a cable and list for about $50 each. You'd save $50 by buying 3 of these instead of the Shures and upgrading later. The majority of singers will never know the difference between the two mics. BTW, my P-51's have been dropped and thrown onto tables by - uh, patrons - who sang while they were impaired. They show no signs of damage at this point.

For the monitor I opted for a 13" tv. I picked it up for $65 (new) and it works very well. I have the option of using an RF convertor and using RG-59 or a long composite video cable to the TV. The LCD panel may be too fragile for the setup/tear down of weekly gigs and will require additional care.

Remember that you'll need cables - to connect the mixer to the speakers, and the mics to the board (if they don't come with the equipment already).

Getting a small CD player to play music while you bring up the next singer is probably a good idea as well. With a single player you will have a short dead space between songs as the next singer comes up and you que the next disc. I'd double check the queing speed of the CAVS w/ SCDG's since there are so many songs on them. I have a couple DVD's that require a minute or more to que a song and that's a lot of dead space to try and fill.

If you're looking at PC based hosting I'd try to stay away from the midi/kar files since the quality of the music is so poor compared to the discs.

Good luck in your new venture! I wish you the best.

Welcome aboard gurlgeek!

First of all, as much as I appreciate allstar's comments, Lonman's the MAN when it comes to sound. I might now other things, but he's the main guy.

I echo meister's comments about simplified equipment as a start. But NOT going CHEAP. Just not top of the game right away. Hey, you get a good, solid gig that pays you $150 a night two nights a week, GREAT, then go pick up the better mics, and keep them stashed away. When a drunk screws up your $50 mic, you're all set up with a better one.

I've had two radio shack wired mics (one a shure Rs230 - equivelent to the PG58) that are around $50 and $60 each... and they're still going strong. No equipment failures!

Secondly, the 2000 songs you're going to get with the CAVS supercdg machine are NOT going to be top of the line... I would suppliment them with probably the Supercore set, foundations 1 & 2, and some new pop hits monthly discs.

Personally, right away, I don't think you need the maximiser. You probably WILL need an Amplifier, so ask Lonman what you recommend.

When I started out, I didn't have the mackie mixer, but instead the AKJ7000 mixer-amp that MORE than meets my needs. since you're only going with a single-tray player, you shouldn't need more than that.

Best of luck to you!

Matt

A lot of sensible inforrmation from my friends. Something else that came in mind regarding mixers. I personally have the Behringer mixers (2 off) and would strongly recommend them if you want value for money. As I stated before, the Mackie is very good, but by bying Behringer you can save quite a bit. Not eveyone will agree, but that why we are 1 happy family !

Regarding PC Hosting, as I said, I use MTU's Hoster, so do many other KJ's. Take some time reading up on their website, URL http://www.mtu.com/basics/karaoke-hoster.htm

Whew, thanks Knightshow for agreeing with me - I was afraid I was going to be the only person that thought that way when I posted.

The only problem you'll have with your budget is the media. Good tracks can be expensive, but there are deals out there. I picked up the Foundations 1 & 2 on e-Bay for $520. The Sweet Georgia Brown 66 disc set was another $100. I have another 20-30 discs (variety of manufacturers) and have about 2000 unique tracks total. Getting a good library built is one of the most expensive parts of getting started from what I've seen. You can cut corners on equipment in the short term, but the library will make or break you if you're not careful. If I had to do it over again, I'd get the Foundations and the 5 Bricks to start with instead of the variety (CDG's, DVD's, and VCD's) and SGB. I'd probably avoid VCD's and DVD's if at all possible. I've had bad experiences with both of them and very few good experiences.

If you don't stick with SCDG's and go with the more common CDG's instead, I recommend going with a JVC 3 tray player instead of the CAVS202G. I bought a new RSQ 3 tray (rebranded JVC) for just over $200 on e-bay.

Make sure you get a good player when you buy - avoid the Ritech DVD players marked as playing CDG's. They will but the swipe isn't smooth with any CDG. It's ok as a dvd player, but not for use as a CDG player in a show. I have a $40 radio shack boom box player that's better than the Ritech DVD player.

I had looked at a GigRac 600 and non-power speakers when I was first getting ready to start doing shows and the total cost was about $900. I opted for a slightly cheaper route and got a portable Fender PA system (PD-250) when I put my system together. Now I'm having to upgrade almost my entire system a short time later. It was ok for one gig I was doing, but now that gig's been canceled and I'm underpowered for most of the shows I can book in the near future. Make sure your system will handle the venues you'll be playing.

Lonman will have a lot more to say, I can just tell you what I've bought and what didn't work. If I made smarter choices in the beginning I'd be much better off now - and would have spent LESS money.

Hey, Thanks for all the replies...

I have spent about 3 days heavily scouring this subject and now I am still just as confused about what I should be getting but at least I know what I won't be getting!! I wanted to get the CAVS 202g cause i thought maybe this was the new wave of the future?? I don't know now. I guess I am waiting for Lonman to reply. I did go to MTU website and didn't really get it, I guess you have to have gotten your feet wet to do that. I dont really want to upgrade my system in a matter of months, perhaps in a year or so, but not the whole thing. Anyway, back to the research!!

Thanks all!

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The best reason for having dreams is that in dreams no reasons are necessary

one thing about the pc hosting:

I wouldn't get into it right away if I were you. OR embrace it fully! ! without UNLEARNING a lot of stuff, you might be better off.

Once a track is ripped down to either mp3g using a free program called mp3toolz, it's in two tracks... a .mp3 and a .cdg. You CAN with a pc using winamp (free), it's various plugins (free as well) have the onscreen stuff...

but you need to set up the pc to do dual screen hosting, or have an individual program that captures "part" of your screen and shows that on the "other" monitor. It can get quite tricky!! Which is why I'd recommend a newbie to stay away from it. However, if you have the tech bug goin' for you and understand a lot of the pc stuff, it might work out for you.

Email me using the llink below, and I can tell you what you need to know about the pc stuff.

other reading: geocities.com/akaraokelounge

Matt

I think you are right! I am a geek and don't think I will have that much of a learning curve but I think I may do that as a backup to the new system. That way I can learn what I need to know. Anyway, I am trying to get something ordered by the end of today. Gotta get the show on the road!!

I've always hated shopping and this is no exception!!!!!!!


Thanks for the help

_________________
The best reason for having dreams is that in dreams no reasons are necessary

WELL,
to get you started with the rest of what you have specified, a peavey pv1500 amp. and a pair of pv sp5g speakers would get the show started. plus you need songbooks, and a monitor.

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I'm Not Dead yet...... But every day Im getting Closer !