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Thanks Odie for clarification on the issues. I thought you do need a SS# for almost anything in US, including food stamp, drivers license and medicare or whatever US based assistance.


Huh? I am really confused now Knightshow. What privilege that these illegal aliens get that rest of us citizens don't get? I don't get it. Do they get some special compensation for making it to US without being caught? Do they get some special rights to vote that we don't get? Do they get special medical coverage that we don't get? Can you please clarify for me?

Almost everything I do as a US citizen, I need my SS#. For my drivers license I need it. If I apply for a job, I need either a passport or two forms of ID, including SS card or drivers license. If I apply for an unemployment, I need my SS#. If I apply for a disability, I need my SS#. Thanks god I never had to apply for foodstamp before but I don't see how someone with no paper would be able to get any of the privilege you are talking about without a SS#.

Unless they have two policies, one for undocumented workers and one for citizens/legal residents at DMV or any of the government facilities, I don't see how they can get those privileges. I have serious doubt that they have two policies. Imagine, "What? You don't have a SS? then you don't have to fill out any form, we will just trust you and send you the money." versus "If you have a SS#, you have to fill out this form in triplicate and return it to us at window 25." I don't see it.

As a side note, a legal resident with a green card, you get screwed from both end. You have to pay taxes as legal resident but you don't get a right to vote because you are not a citizen. So, you do not get representation with taxation, which is not what our forefathers said we should have.

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Seize the day and SING!!!

Any & all I feel should be welcomed to our country...PROVIDED they are coming to America to BECOME Americans!  Don't come to our country & expect to speak your language...LEARN English, that is our language!  Christmas is a part of our culture...deal with it...you're an American!  MERRY CHRISTMAS!!!
In God we Trust is written on all our currency, the majority believe in God...it doesn't specify which God so keep on believing in yours!  A minority got offended because God was mentioned in the Pledge of Allegience...tough nookie!

Learn the rules of the road as well.

Take a lesson from your ancestors that immagrated from other countries to become Americans!  They all LEARNED the language, they incoporated themselves into our culture & beliefs.  If you want it to be more like YOUR country...GO BACK THERE~!

If I went to become a citizen of your country I would fully anticipate to learn the language & your beliefs/customs because I moved there to become a PART of it not to put it down/try to change/be disgusted or offended by it!

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[shadow=deepskyblue]I'm impressed, I've never met such a small mind inside such a big head before.[/shadow]

Driver's License.

http://www.oregoncatalyst.com/index.php ... liens.html

on the food stamp issue, yes, the illegals are not supposed to get any, but I'm telling you I've seen it with my own eyes. along with welfare and medical aid.

Never said your views were less relevant.  Only was trying to say that age and first hand experience does often give insight to one who hasn't actual "traveled that road."  ie.  My son is 27 years old.  When he was 15 I was probably the stupidist person in the world.  Within the last 5 I have become one of the smartest. Go figure.

The Liberal Republican Party of the United States was a political party formed in 1872 to oppose the reelection of President Ulysses S. Grant.  Of course that was BEFORE your time.  Mine too.  Present day "liberal Republicans" are also being referred to as "RINOS."  (Republican in name only.)   There are also "DINOS."

And again, I didn't have ANY intentions.  I wasn't trying to make you mad.  Me saying I didn't really care was part of my point with what is wrong with this country.  We have gotten to the point where we care too much about making someone mad rather than saying and doing what is right.

Kelly

No, they don't require a SSN to get benefits here. I work where I pull complete DMV and credit backgrounds on people every day
..... most of them HAVE no SSN..... and that's just the small percentage that actually come IN to businesses like mine:) They tell me no, they don't... and if they were lying, it would show up on the reports I pull anyhow.  They have a license, and when you ask their occupation, it's generally "I'm currently on welfare".

"Migrant farm worker" overrules this, because the term "migrant" is assuming they are here temporarily, for work. They do NOT fall under the same category as permanent residents of the US. SSN is not required for them to receive benefits.

Eben, it's great for those Europeans and anyone else who learn 3 or more languages... more power to them. Two of my kids are learning spanish in school (the only foreign language offered here now, big surprise) and they are happy to be learning it. But it's NOT because they HAVE to learn it to have an occupation, it's their choice. Nothing wrong with learning to speak other languages at all. I know a smidge of spanish myself, as well as russian... but I wont HAVE to learn one to have a job here. Sure, the US is diverse, but it IS the US. People immigrating should learn english. If I were to move to another country, sure I'd take the time to learn their language. Until that happens, I'll stick with what is my native language.

And no, I may not have travelled the world, but we're not talking about the world, we're talking about the US.... and I DO know how it is here. You yourself should take heed to what you proclaim to be "truth" in Oregon, you don't live here. And it seems I recall you saying you had never been here?

California may have stricter rules, but then again, I'm sure California did that along with all the welfare reform years ago... they had to, it was a situation getting out of control. (and yes, I do know this, I lived there for 10 years)

People need to respect other people's opinions, or not join threads like this. Nor should you poke your head in the door just to post links.... dur, dur...I think we all know how to google. Again, I stand by my opinion. I'm not racist (however, call it what you will, people of many nationalities who know me in person would laugh at you for claiming I am) , but I don't like to be TREATED as a minority in my own country either. And that is what is happening in areas like mine. Diversity is fine... and a good thing. But only when each diverse group is pulling their own weight, rather than expecting to be taken care of by the rest. Take your Asian communities, and your Russians.... they come here legally, they learn to speak English, they work toward purchasing homes and they more often than not open their own businesses here.... they DON'T rely on welfare and the American's taxes to support them. It's.. plain and simple... the mexican illegals who do this.

.

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♥ Laugh your heart out, dance in the rain. Cherish the memories, ignore the pain. Love and learn, forget and forgive. Because you only have one life to live. ♥

Here in Greeley we are in the minority. It is not uncommon to see half the store signs in a block in spanish. And half of those in english are owned by iranians or mexicans. The swift beef plant (largest in the world) was recently sold to a co in brazil. Another large ag business con-agra is owned by a japanese or may australian co I forget. This is a typical comment to the editor.

"Not in Spanish

Regarding Thursday's Two Cents caller Alex, "Practice religion freely." I'd be happy to shop at the Mexican grocery stores and "open my mind" to what's out there in the world. The fact is, I won't stop at any store that advertises in Spanish or any language that I can't understand. I don't have a clue what they're advertising, so why would I even want to go inside? I am an American, this is America -- so advertise in English.

Ann, Greeley"

Immigration is only the tip of the iceberg. Local city and county poltocos have sold out to big develpoers. Famers wells are being shut off to meet the demands of huge developments. Suburbs around denver have bought water rights for sections in north co. They are not being irrigated and turning into dust bowls. They are going to start water mining uranium between nunn and wellington. Farmers have been forced out for years and lost or sold 3rd and 4th generation farms or ranches.

The liberal press is more concerned with drunk drivers sex offenders and paris shilton or whoever that othe ass-hole is. On a national level all they are concerned with is getting the dems back in the white house.. The senate and congress has sold out to the drug dealers legal and non-legal and I'll leave it up to you to guess the others. They call in the fbi and everybody else as to why the levies didnt hold or a bridge collapse. What a farce.. They have destoyed the economy At one time a man or woman either one could work 40 hours a week and support a big family. We had the largest standard of living in the world. For years I got so sick of " Oh they need to fix the economy" Unless we are russia or totally socialistic they shouldnt even be messing with it.

They are raping this nation and sending all down the river with no paddle. Dont believe me? Open up your eyes and start looking around.

EDIT Now that the anti-tobacco nazis are getting their way the number one ag crop in many states now is marijauna..

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Whew, ok a lot of ground to cover.

First off, Charmin...


Americans are all colors of the rainbow... what does white men getting the jobs of the mexicans have to do with it?    Next how do you know those people working in the field ARE indeed illegal?  Have you asked them or their employer? I mean brown skin doesn't equal illegal. Lets assume that all those people in the fields are illegal... aren't black men and yellow men entitled to those jobs as well?  

Now I think the problem here is that too many people are stating just opinions and not showing the facts of how they formed them.  So here we go.

We'll go with last year's census.

Over 300,000,000 People in America. Estimated 7,000,000 (that is considered a high estimate) are illegal aliens OF that 300,000,000.  Of the 7,000,000; 4,900,000 are Mexican illegal immigrants.

Now welfare statistics 1,900,000  families get welfare benefits here in the USA; in one-third of them, only the children qualify for aid. 38% of those on welfare are black, 33% white and 24% Hispanic.  So that means 722,000 of the people on welfare are black, 627,000 are white, and 456,000 are of hispanic( not just mexican) decent.  How on earth do you figure all 4,900,000 illegal mexican immigrants are on welfare?  Or even CLOSE to all of them? Even IF all 456,000 were Mexican and even IF they were all illegal that wouldn't be a TENTH of the illegal Mexican immigrants in this country.  Like I said, they are hard working people just trying to make a better life for themselves.

The TRUTH of the matter is that to try and claim welfare benefits for an illegal alien is one of the riskiest things you could do.  First you have to get your hands on a fake SSN, and I'm sure you can imagine how much that costs... I'll tell you this, according to Immigration and Naturalization for a borrowed SSN cost starts at a grand. Now, you DO have to have an SSN for benefits, and guess what else, you also HAVE to have a job in which you have to provide documents from your employer as to your salary and hours worked ( though required hours to qualify vary by state).  An employer is not going to lie for an illegal... they could lose their business all together.  Anyone wanting to validate that info merely has to go to google and type in welfare requirements.  And if they've got a job and are collecting welfare benefits.... that means they are paying taxes on that SS number.

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[scroll][glow=darkorchid]~I'm the girl your mother warned you about~[/scroll][/glow]

I'm waiting for it..... I'm sure there's more you can blame on us, didn't we pillage at one point?  And you're right, GOD what were we thinking wasting time on drunk drivers which according to FARS (Fatality Analysis Reporting System) results in a death every 32 minutes.  And sex offenders, pfft what a waste of time.... especially when according to the Justice department...

-On a given day in 1994 there were approximately 234,000 offenders convicted of rape or sexual assault under the care, custody, or control of corrections agencies; nearly 60% of these sex offenders are under conditional supervision in the community.
-The median age of the victims of imprisoned sexual assaulters was less than 13 years old; the median age of rape victims was about 22 years.
-An estimated 24% of those serving time for rape and 19% of those serving time for sexual assault had been on probation or parole at the time of the offense for which they were in State prison in 1991.
-Of the 9,691 male sex offenders released from prisons in 15 States in 1994, 5.3% were rearrested for a new sex crime within 3 years of release.
-Of released sex offenders who allegedly committed another sex crime, 40% perpetrated the new offense within a year or less from their prison discharge.

We really shouldn't waste our time on this and we should be trying to find those connections congress has with those drug dealers.

A man or woman can STILL earn a living for a large family with only 40 hours a week.  The thing is that... society kinda moved forward and to make that money, you have to be educated.  A college degree.  But since you suggest we broke the economy but.... we shouldn't be allowed to fix it.... you haven't left us many options now have you?

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[scroll][glow=darkorchid]~I'm the girl your mother warned you about~[/scroll][/glow]

Then they shouldn't shop there. It's their choice. Don't do it but don't go preaching others about it. It's each individual's choice. By going out there an shouting "Do it may way or it's wrong" is not expressing the first amendment. It's suppressing the first amendment by others who wants to advertise in Spanish or whatever language they want to.



Hmm, I think you need to think about where the country is going. Where is our strength lie in the future? Farming? I don't think so. The economic power is shifting to the technology. If you are going to ride out the farming trend, you will get so far behind the rest of the world. If we hold on to farming as our primary focus, we will still be riding the horse carriage and holding torch lights. Our average death age would be 47, as it was about 100 years ago. We would still be sending mail through pony express rather than online sending emails. Progress is what makes who we are. We need to move on to what is the future, not past.



Ok, my politics a side let's look at the realities of the past. The last recession that hit us was in 1974. Who was the president? Richard Nixon, a conservative. When Reagan was president, and first Bush was the VP, our prime lending rate was over 20%. We were in crisis mode economically. In 2001, we had a collapse of high tech economy. Who was the president then? Bush number 2. Every time we had economical disaster in the past, a conservative was in charge.

By contrast, while Clinton was in charge, our nation deficit was the lowest in decades. We had strongest economy in the world.

Now, who destroyed the economy? Liberals? I don't think so. We do need to fix the economy. The world is different now then before. We don't have major wars anymore, like WWII. We have economic wars. If we don't keep up with the rest of the world or better, we will be left behind, like many countries who lost the was after a major war.



I have opened my eyes. I did my research in to this. I just happen to have different opinion then you.



I would love to see some research where you got this "fact" Last time I saw, one of largest lobby group in Washington is tobacco industry. They spend more money then 99% of the industry in the country, including high tech. Yet they are losing their battle in government. Why? Because people have spoken and politicians are listening to votes more than money.

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Seize the day and SING!!!

First off, a neighbor harvesting "home-grown" pot in his basement or backyard is comparing apples to oranges.  The fact that Tobacco might or might not be grown in certain states again, is moot.  Where is the number one agricultural crop Marijuana ?

I agree with Ben 100%.  If you are going to quote statistics please cite your source. Embellishing fact based on opinion has little merit !  (OK,  I think I agree 100% but of course this is my opinion)

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I said politicos that includes both gop and dems..

link Thgat waas 10 years ago Care to guess what it is now?

Eben Ive been allover the world too. And I love ya man but I tire of those on either coast that claim to know whats going on in the middle.

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No, you said the liberal press

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[scroll][glow=darkorchid]~I'm the girl your mother warned you about~[/scroll][/glow]

WRONG !    In CT Marijuana NEVER was near the largest revenue producing "crop". This study is taking statistics that CAN NOT be accurately shown, and using them to sensationalize disregarding urban legend from fact.

CONNECTICUT IS FIRST IN NEW ENGLAND IN:

Net Farm Income ('02)
Horse Number - (Garnet Study)   <--- Not as in Heroin !
Mushroom Production        <----- doesn't mean psilocybin
Peach and Pear Production ('03)
Tobacco Acreage and Production ('03)  <--- not the wacky brand
Density of Egg Laying Poultry ('03)
Bedding and Garden Plant Income ($61 million) ('03)   <--doesn't mean pot
Nursery and Greenhouse Sales ($197,570,000)   <--- doesn't mean pot
Per Acre Value Per Farm ($9,500)
Herbaceous Perennial Potted Plants ($25,585,000)  <--- no, doesn't mean THAT herb

We have massive areas of Tobacco field up in N Simsbury,  Granby as far as the eye can see.  Tobacco is still going strong !

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Me thinks this is a good thing if weed were present in this thread there'd be a lot less aggression and a lot more cheetos

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[scroll][glow=darkorchid]~I'm the girl your mother warned you about~[/scroll][/glow]

I am sorry about being confused. When the federal law mandate, as Odie listed, to have a SS# to be on welfare, how can they the illegals get all these benefits like DMV and Credit background (BTW, to have a credit score, you HAVE to have a SSN)? I am very confused. Can you tell me how they do this?



The migrant workers do have rights because they are in this country under a different type of visa. Visa gives them certain rights. There are over 150,000 students in the US under a student visa. They have many rights but they are not permanent resident or US citizens. None of these people are illegal aliens. They are legal visitors to US and they have many rights and get benefits because they enter this country legally. Let's get that straight.



I don't disagree with you that they shouldn't learn English. Let me give you this scenario. My grandparents came over to US, legally, when they were 65 years old. I don't know about you, but at age 65, it's damn difficult to learn a new language. My grandfather did learn enough to get around but not everyone has knack of language at late age. It's not to say that they aren't trying.

Look at the kids in schools around you who are immigrants, doesn't matter legal or illegal. They pick up the languages quickly because they are young. As you get older, it's harder to learn new things.

Let me ask you this question, if you were to go overseas, let's say to Saudi Arabia. Would you drop English all together and speak only Arabic when you are in Saudi Arabia? Would make sure your kids or grandkids never learn English, only Arabic? Would you teach your kids never celebrate Halloween or Thanksgiving, or even Christmas since you are living in a Muslin world and Christianity is not really celebrated? Of course not. You are asking people to give up their culture and language just because they are in the US? I think that's pretty presumptuous of you, don't you think? Just remember that next time you celebrate Halloween, Thanksgiving or Christmas.



Actually, I have traveled to Oregon several times on business. Mostly to  cities like Eugene, etc. I didn't claim anything to be true, I was just quoting what Odie has listed above as the truth. He did the research and so did I. The Internet is a wonderful thing you know. You don't have to be there to know what's going on, at least most of the time.



Hmm, you just inferred that since I never been to Oregon, I must not know what's going on there. Yet you haven't been to California in a while yet you do know what's going on in California? I sure would like to see some research material to support claim.



First of all. I thought I was being very respectable of everyone's opinion. I just showed what I believe is the truth. I think Odie did it right, show the research to show what is the fact from what is an opinion.

I think Magz's stats are right on. At worst case, less than 5% of the whole nation is in that category of illegal and mooching off our government. Look at the stats. If you take out all the legal immigrants and visitors, and you have to count migrant workers, students, etc. as legal visitors who are legally given the benefits, the total number would be very small. I would venture less than 1% of the total population. Specially when you are required to have SSN to get any kind of public assistance.

That's not anywhere near majority. Just because people speak a different language doesn't mean they are illegal aliens. That means they are culturally diverse. They are probably a US citizen like you and me.

So, it sounds like your gripe is in a different area, not illegal aliens who are mooching off us. It's seems like you are complaining about legal residents who may not be making an effort to learn the language of English or trying to fit in culturally. Are you questioning their right to be who they are as a legal resident of this country? That to me sounds like a thinly veiled discrimination to me.

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Seize the day and SING!!!

The senate and congress has sold out to the drug dealers legal and non-legal and I'll leave it up to you to guess the others. They call in the fbi and everybody else as to why the levies didnt hold or a bridge collapse. What a farce.. They have destoyed the economy At one time a man or woman either one could work 40 hours a week and support a big family. We had the largest standard of living in the world. For years I got so sick of " Oh they need to fix the economy" Unless we are russia or totally socialistic they shouldnt even be messing with it.

They are raping this nation and sending all down the river with no paddle. Dont believe me? Open up your eyes and start looking around.

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I'd be freaking out.  I hallucinate on the stuff REALLY badly !  Some of us with anxiety issues can't handle pot.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

You are citing a report 10 years ago as the fact and current? Again, assumptions here. Where are the current stats? I am sorry, I am being an A$$ but I want to know.

Besides, how did we get so off track about this thread? Where does illegal drugs come in to the picture when talking about immigration?

I never claimed I know what's going on in the middle. Show me where I said that. Everything I stated was based on my opinion based on where I live and based on the facts from the Internet. Show me where I said anything about mid west or any other parts of the country.

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Seize the day and SING!!!

Colorado is number one in
   Beer
   Rockets
   Weed

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Again, I guess you would rather be in a recession, or oil crisis, or interest rate over 20%, like we did under the past conservative leadership. I guess if we are in recession, we don't need to fix the economy? I don't get it. Don't mess with my credit card interest rate being 25%? My mortgage rate over 20%? Get in line to get gas at a local gas station? Unemployment rate of over 15%? I don't think so.

I want to open my eyes and look around. Show me some articles that shows how liberals raping this nation. I don't mean that conservative media like FOX, just neutral studies or research that shows me these FACTS. I want to learn. Seriously.

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Seize the day and SING!!!