Karaoke Forums

OK,  Just reread two of my posts,  and I'm suddenly exhausted,  night all !

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Yes, those were some really below the belt comments that person made--it came and went so fast I didn't know anybody saw that before he changed his mind and edited it very quickly. I asked for it I know so....well, besides that my consensus is I'm not a professional singer and I don't make a living or get paid to do this stuff. One aspect of my life that I rarely talk about is in my early 20s I did work professionally as a pianist with various pick up orks in some of the casinos. One of these days I'll have to see if I can rig up the mic and equipment and run off a number to submit.  I can remember one night the person I was dating at the time, a viola player in another unit by the way, lambasted me for drowning out the opening act singer (honest to God I can't even remember her name now).  Now, that really bothered me because I'm up there, an alleged paid professional pianist and I'm not doing my job correctly.

On the other hand, when I used to go into the dives that had pianos in Atlantic City (I used to play the piano bars unsolicited just to get free drinks--I was quite the boozer in my day) and somebody made a passive or not wholly flattering comment about my playing, I'd let it go because I realized I was just "slumming" and not always performing at a level I knew I was capable of.

My impression since I joined this outfit was it was place to sing for fun and if you like something fine, but if not, please be careful in how you say it and especially if the singer has not asked for something along the lines of a stringent assessment.  With this particular gentleman, I asked him very politely to next time perhaps be a little more specific in his criticism, let me know where I'm doing such and such a thing. I had a long discussion with Steve about this the other night.  Following my suggestion to Music Critic, I unwisely, made a self-deprecating comment about my submission of "The House I Live In" (I said "I butchered this...but I wanted to submit something for the 4th (paraphrase").  The fact is I had been up three days with insomnia, smoked too much and had lips as dry as the sands of the Sahara but really wanted to offer this song up as it's usually neglected this time of year.  The following day I receive a comment from him on this one:  "Your sure did".  That was completely gratuitious and unnecessary and I wouldn't be completely human if I didn't flip my lid.

Myself, I listen to my favorite singers on here all the time.  A lot of them sing music I'm not especially inclined to listen to but if I like something about their voice or their delivery I will listen and hopefully learn a few things from them.  I listen to people who may not be viewed as "really solid", but they too are fun to listen to and make me happy on occasion.  One of the greatest guys on this site (and I can't mention his name) has some of the best phrasing I've ever heard; his voice is pretty much used up (geez I hate saying these things--he's up in years) but I listen to this fellow and learn much.  If someone said his voice sounded like sand paper I'd want names and phone numbers.

I know this is not a competition here--I will admit I get jealous from time to time--but you have what, some 100 different voices echoing off this website, each one different from the rest, if you're going to be selective on who should get feedback like I received from this individual, it's pretty hard to be fair about it.  I'm sure a lot of you do the same as me: when I've done something I think is pretty fancy and a challenge for me, I'll specifically ask to be critiqued or ranked (and that rank button should be explained more to new people--maybe that's something to look into), or I will consult someone I believe has the ability to make a discerning critique, whether it's someone I think sings well or a person I have faith in giving me the clean facts, not somebody, who for all I know, might be a 13 year old or an animated head living in a cakepan full of plasma hooked up to tubes connected to the computer and---wait, when I start talking about the cakepan head I know I need to sit back and get myself together!   Take care.

That's the thing Michael,  ANYONE can join this site.. Not everyone is mature, and decent.. The vast majority however are..  Problem I have, is during certain times, there can be 50 I like, and respect... Yet for God know's  what reason, It's that ONE #*%#@ that will get to me.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Just out of curiosity--I find you rather interesting Steve--what kind of piano do you play?


(PS:  Don't say "Baldwin")

One of these days I'd like to discuss the merits of upright grands over baby grands--Gershwin always preferred the former. Oh yeah, I'm UP again. Like my celebrity correspondent  Gilbert Gottfried used to intone on the USA channel some years ago, "UP ALL NIGHT!!!"  Remember that show? They showed some of the most arcane flicks of all time with titles such as "Sorority Chicks in the Slimeball Bowl-a-Rama" (uncontestably THE greatest movie title in cinema history).  

By the way, I was man enough to remove this "glowing tribute" to a certain critic off SS that I hastily put up. I hope I didn't disappoint you by doing what I did--I just can't hep myself sometimes--it did seem to help a lot of people blow off some building steam (I had no idea how charged up people were getting about this guy)but at least I did it creatively, so it was worth something I suppose. Change for a penny, 25 cents off your next purchase of a 6" Subway Chicken Supreme Lite--in that price range I would estimate.....

For myself I don't care how I get critiqued as long as the person doing the critique is doing so honestly.  It's beyond me how some of the individuals here get so ripped up because someone doesn't like their rendition of a song or their voice.  It doesn't matter how great of a singer you are, or think you are, everyone is not going to love you. I've read a lot of the critiques and I've come to really value a few of the individuals here on this site that offer honest critiques.  Folks I'm not sleeping with you, your not paying my rent, and ya didn't hire me to sing; so, it's not going to kill me if you can't stand my singing.

If you sub and I dislike your singing, I wont offer a critique; singing is supposed to be fun, even for the ones that can't really sing. But, if I think you have a fantastic voice and that you've selected the wrong gender for yourself I may say so.  I listened to one sub by a young lady here on this site, her voice is fabulous but when she sang the song she selected, I felt she didn't push her voice to the point to were she should have for that particular song.  I didn't critique because I wasn't really sure how to word it - it was more of a feeling than something technical.

I think Michael offered an honest critique and I also think the critique was handled perfectly.



                                                Jackson

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Singing just for you

Nah,  I play a jewish Piano,  It's a Steinham !

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Having a bad hair day here, or at least I would be having one if I had any hair.  My post was ment for Jeff's hidden agenda thread not here.  Sorrrrrrrrrrrry This is not going to be a good day.

                                      Jackson

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Singing just for you

Yep, this is very true.  A comment may be very harsh and poorly detailed.  It all has to be taken with a grain of salt. In addition, A GOOD critic ideally pin points and backs up his comments, but this isn't and shouldn't be required. The music business can be mean spirited at times and the better singer/player may receive the toughest comments from other good singers/players.  However, the most rewarding comments can come from these same people too. IMO

Actually I was wrong about the name.... It says on the harp inside

"Steinberg & Son's"   Hecho en Mehico


I didn't do badly for a White Van special did I ?    They told me it's brand new, hot off the truck, and should be ready to hold strings...





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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Now that's a tidy room!  Lots of greenery too.

No foo, I mean what type of music do you play? I'm betting you can do classical (but then any of us who have had years of grueling, rigorous training have that ability to some degree more or less--I like listening to classical but never get into it unless it is some peppy rondo or mazurka.  Bach has a hypnotizing effect on me, I still do enjoy playing those compositions).  I had the coolest teacher I studied with growing up.  Her name was Miss Ray (always "Miss Ray").  She was a pip. Always wore a page boy haircut and rose colored glasses and had the stubbiest fingers I've ever seen.  I remember my mom taking me in for the first time to her studio and she sat me down and played her (@$%&#!) off--barrelhouse boogie woogie--those little fingers rolling 10th's with ease. I'll never forget that day as long as I live.  I learned as the years went by she was in rather reduced circumstances (past her "salad days" I'd guess you'd say) because she did arranging for Radio City Music Hall at some period.  One day I came in and this guy was talking to Miss Ray.  His name was Rusty and he had been a pupil of hers long ago.  He had divorced Juliette Mills. Miss Ray pointed out that Rusty had met Juliette Mills when they were both students of hers.  This was when "Nanny and the Professor" was a popular sitcom.  Haley Mills was also one of her students--I'm certain this is when Miss Ray was teaching voice as well as piano.  Jesus, I mean, these two kids were the daughters of Sir John Mills the noted actor!! All of this in this little studio building on Atlantic Avenue in Atlantic City, New Jersey.  I'm sorry....that felt right to write about for me.  Where was I now?

Studio's, or Upright grands still have the 36 inch harp, don't they ?  THey are baby grands... Just different projection...  Never buy an old one with that rattle-cage action...hehe

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I could grab my tape measure and run upstairs but I'd say 36" sounds about right.  I find that style piano more beneficial in really hearing clearly what I'm sounding like.

Organ too! Very impressive! Nice to see real instruments for a change instead of electronics (nothing wrong with those either but I think pianos and organs are on the verge of extinction). Looking at the piano is like looking at a good friend.

It makes sense that the way the studio projects, and it's close placement to a wall would in fact condense the travel of sound waves and give you a more concentrated path of sound...A baby grand is more diffused

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I thought I had mentioned this but maybe it didn't stick. I removed my glowing "tribute" to a certain so-and-so. I think enough is enough there, and I hope I didn't disappoint anybody by losin' my gourd like that but hey, I can't hep myself sometimes you know? At least I was creative--that alone is worth something I guess..change for a penny, 25 cents off your next purchase of a Subway Chicken De-Lite Sandwich, etc.  Besides that Steve, I am listening to one of my submissions and you know something? I'm pretty good! I learned a valuable lesson from this and that is have faith in myself, know when to ask for help and above all KEEP A COOL HEAD and rise above the morass, at the very least just below eye level.

If you can apply that, you are a stronger person than I am Michael... I still have esteem and ego issues... I wouldn't feel comfortable in a place such as Singer's Showcase,  My own feelings are (and these are MY feelings and issues).  The invisible audience out there listening in Singer's Showcase is a brutally critical group in real, you just will never see it... People listening from the comfort of their own home, that also submit material are most liking comparing and judging.. Just my thought's on this... It's a less "personal" auditorium..

I also feel it's quite safe for some of you that are in general VERY good musicians, and practiced singer's who are ready to perform on-stage... I think for some, submitting in SS is masochistic...  For other's, I think it's great... I believe most that do submit in SS are pretty confident in their ability.  Just my guess

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Maybe this is a good time to sound off about critics in general (the ones who do it for a living).  It has always seemed to me that there comes a time in a critics career where the performance is viewed not just as a performance but as something that must be held up to a standard of perfection and then compared to that standard.

Years ago the Milwaukee Journal had a music critic who rarely said anything positive about any performance.  After reading a number of his reviews it became apparent that his personal taste ran only to rock and roll and specifically to hard rock.  There were bands he loved and when they came to town his review was always glowing.  

This guy once reviewed Pete Seeger who is venerated in the folk music world.  I happened to have been at the concert and being a Seeger fan I had enjoyed it.  When I read the review the next day I wondered whether we had both been to the same concert.  He complained that Seeger's voice wasn't what it had once been.  The man was in his 70's.  Of course it wasn't what it had once been.  But Seeger's voice has never been as pristine as, say, Joan Baez.  Seeger is a folk singer and in my opinion the best folk performances ought to be relaxed and intimate and ought to sound something like a bunch of people sitting around on someone's front porch on Saturday night.  The reveiwer didn't like that.  He didn't like the casual atmosphere and he didn't much like the material.  If I were to have offered a critique of the critique the first thing I might have said was that the quality of the critique might have been improved if the reviewer new the first thing about folk music or the traditions of folk music performances.

I'm taking a very long time to get around to my point here which is this; many reviewers seem to fall in love with the fact that they are the ones who get to set the standards and they are the ones who get to do the measuring.  A couple of weeks ago I heard a movie critic bemoaning the fact that successful movies are often hated by the critics and that the movie going population doesn't seem to pay much attention to what the critics say.

He was, in my opinion, absolutely right.  And the reason is that the critics have lost touch with their audience.  

Offering criticism here is much the same.  The audience is a group of other people who are all doing the same thing.  They are subbing their stuff for pleasure.  Nobody's getting paid and it's very unlikely that any of us are ever going to figure out how to make a living as a karaoke singer.  We do this stuff because it's fun.  Some are more serious about it than others but in the end it's just fun.  Whatever criticism is offered on this site ought to take that into consideration.  

Larry

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"Life is too short for diet soda and lite beer"

There's a bigger problem I personally have Larry.  I was raised having it instilled in me, that if you aren't able to give 100%, and excel in something You DO NOT do it on stage... If a person is rusty, THEY DO NOT perform....


Just my upbringing as a performer.... Some things are done behind closed doors.. A performance isn't done with intent of being just "Mediocre"

I was taught that YOU DON'T make mistakes when performing... It's not "What if" I make a mistake,  YOU DON'T...  It's a critical time, and that's the purpose. A person is performing for other's entertainment, and to be judged...

THat's why I don't submit hack stuff I have,  or play for people when I'm as rusty as I am now... Those aren't conditions a person should ever perform under....

This is strictly instilled in me.... There's 0 margin for error during performance,  A recital if it's students for students in a music school is what trial and error is for... getting feet wet for the real thing...  Playing solo piano I was a nervous wreck,  It's not what I'm cut out to do... I back people... Not solo....


OK,  Now I can take a deep breath and back up....   That was an intense moment

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

I don't see it that way at all Larry.  A performance in Singer's Showcase, is a performance the whole internet world can listen to.  A very low percentage of those listening are also subbing songs.... assuming a person has their material up for any duration...  Is there a way to know how many that aren't members here are clicking on your song and listening ?  People that never signed up to join Karaoke scene ?

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".