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I would have a few choice words for him, that would get totally censored here, if I tried to type them.
My collection is built on my singers' requests, and will continue to be that way.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Believe I am like 3 years older than yoou

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For all we know.......it was The Lone Ranger.....

-Chris

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-Chris

How could that be, was he wearing a mask made from his dead brother's vest and did he ride up on a white stallion, I never leave home without mine? Did he leave a sliver bullet?

> still older!!!

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Same boat. A good library has never been about quantity- it's always been about selection.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

VERY true!!!

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I'm glad that you are least open to the idea that he may have been something other than a Pirate. I guess we will never know for sure, he didn't come back did he? I'm still wondering why he offered to help you for no money?[/quote]


Tonight is my weekly show he was at last week, we shall see

back when i was still hosting, I used to specifically go out of my way to try and get the rarest tracks i possibly could.

so i was always looking for the track that was only produced by one or two labels. Unfortunately for me, it got too expensive to keep up.

But I can definately say I am absolutely regretting selling my Gamesman disc when i needed some spare cash. Worst mistake i ever made.

oh well, live and learn

-James

I remember the first year I started hosting (2009), I didn't even know what a pirate was. I had approx 500 songs in my library and I had one karaoke gig. I started out charging $150, then went down to $100, then went down to $60 because I just couldn't build up any kind of crowd there and I felt bad for the owner of the bar because he took a chance on me by giving me my first weekly karaoke job. It was my first gig and I was determined to stick it out and make it successful.

One night I went to a karaoke bar to observe a veteran kj. When I told him what song I wanted to sing, we chatted a little bit and during our chat, I told him I was a kj at another local bar. He asked me how much was I charging. I told him $60, but I was trying to build up the place and hopefully start making more money when business picked up. He turned red and became infuriated at me. He said, "Wow! So you're a pirate!!! How many songs do you have and where did you get them from?" I had no idea what he was talking about or why he was so angry at me. I told him I only had about 500 songs because they were so expensive, that's all I could afford at the time. I told him I was just getting started and trying to do the best I could and I hoped that one day I could get on his level. He insulted me a few more times and then I got mad and I remember insulting him back and giving him an evil look.

I went ahead and sang my song but when I went to my seat, I felt very bad because I didn't understand what was going on. I was so new in the business and didn't know anything about karaoke legalities or pirates or anything.

Before I left the bar, I went up to him and apologized for my behavior and told him I didn't want any trouble. I was just out trying to have a good time and also observe his skills because I looked up to him as a kj and I was trying to learn from him thru observation. He apologized to me as well and said he thought I was a pirate but after thinking it over, he said he realized that I wasn't one and he judged me too quickly.

Later that night when I got home, I got on the internet and read up tons of information on karaoke legalities and pirates and my head almost exploded. I had NO IDEA at that time that all that existed.

Vince it wasn't always like this, I worked in the business for over 19 years and didn't really hear anything about piracy until I started frequenting these forums. I guess I was lucky to be in an area where there was plenty of work and most of the hosts were at least civil to each other. There is no book telling you how to be a great host, nor is there any type of school or piece of paper to obtain. It is all a learning process and when you stop learning then you stagnate as a host, or a person for that matter. Never stop learning and trying to improve your show, it is a constant process.

What you did could be considered undercutting. Although you didn't actually undercut another KJ, you are undercutting the average going rate for a show (regardless of how noble your intentions might be), and if one Venue Owner mentions what he is paying for Karaoke to another Venue Owner, then the other Venue Owner may try to get over on that as well.


What you described here is one of my pet peeves... that someone would ASSUME you're a pirate just because you're undercutting the price of others. Undercutting and Piracy are NOT synonymous, and too many people seem to think otherwise. I'm glad that you 2 at least were able to talk it out afterwards.

Yes, during our apologies to each other, I asked him why did he call me a pirate and he said because only a pirate could afford to do a show for $60 because they don't have to pay for their music with all their illegal hard drives.

Anyway, that was almost 5 years ago. Hosting karaoke for me at that time was just a hobby, something I was trying to get good at. It was not my main job. Today, karaoke is my lifeline. It is my full time job. It pays all my bills and I am very serious about it. Through trial and error, reading and studying and plenty of experimentation, I have become one of the top kjs around. Remember that gig where I went to study that veteran kj and he insulted me? That is now one of my gigs. He went on vacation one year and the owners contacted me. They told me they didn't want him to return and asked if I would take over if they let him go. I accepted their offer. That was in the summer of 2012 and I've been there ever since.

About a year into that job, the former kj came in one night, sat at a table with friends and just observed me. About an hour in, he came up to me and said I was doing a great job and was very impressed with the sound. We shook hands and I told him I hope he didn't harbor any bad feelings against me for replacing him. He said he didn't, but also said he didn't understand why they let him go. I felt kinda sorry for him. He's surviving though. With his reputation and experience, he will always work.

If your still working for 60 dollars ...........

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A host has to be worth something before he can expect to get paid, the more experience you have, the better your equipment and show is, the more professionally you execute your duties, the greater your return should be. You have to crawl before you walk, and you have to walk before you run. If in the case of Vince with only 500 songs to start with and limited experience you can't expect top dollar right off the bat. Some hosts luck into good situations, and having contacts to help you get started in business and stay in business is always important. That is why you never try to step on people on the way up, you will meet them also on the way down. Anyone that has been in this business any length of time knows there are highs and lows. One thing for sure is not to bad mouth any hosts even if they are doing the same to you. The singers get tired of it and they think you as a host are trying to use them as a pawn, in your game with the opposing host.

You can't be serious, right?

I agree with you 100%!!! I used to be part of a loyal following with 1 KJ about 18 years ago. I stopped going to his show when it got to the point that he always had something nasty to say about other KJs. It wasn't even about that so much, as it was more of him coming by and sitting next to me (while he had some Singer already up on the stage), and then start to dish the latest dirt he had on this KJ or that KJ. It was more like he was trying to pit his other regulars to be against any other KJ, and that started to become old hat real fast.

I knew of piracy going on before the forums. In 1995 I met a guy who wanted to 'borrow' my library, I of course declined however asked why. He told me he had a cd duplicator & wanted to copy all my discs to add to his show in turn he'd give me a copy of everything he had as well. Which is when I started the thought - why the hell would I want any of my competition to have anything I had if they didn't buy it - that kind of gives me an edge - but at that time I didn't know how rampant it was about to become. Another guy I knew around '96 actually had a karaoke store front AND ran multiple shows. He would actually get the new discs, copy them to his hard drive - copy it over for all systems, then re-shrink wrap & sell the disc as new then go out and run shows for the then ridiculously low rate of $200 per show x5 systems when most kj's were getting $250-350 on avg per show. There were several kj's in this area alone that had these cd burners in their mobile rack and would copy customer discs on the spot while they were waiting to sing. This was all before 2000. Once computer ripping became readily available, it flourished.

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Back before I knew any better, I used to hang out on the MIRC channels. I occasionally would download a song for several friends..


Then I casually mentioned the channels to a hosting friend of mine. She spent the next six months downloading every single sounchoice track that ever existed at that time, and made her own burns.

She swore up and down that she only would use them for her personal use but that only lasted about two months, when I saw her using them at some bar she had just picked up.

The silly thing about it all was she became a channel moderator and banned me for telling another person about the channels.. LIke it was some big state secret..


man I can't believe i was ever that naive..

It is all about insecurity cue, we doubt our own abilities and our product and we feel threatened by any and all types of competition. This gets worse during bad economic times and tight markets for a certain product. This KJ you describe cue probably didn't feel the squeeze when he first started hosting, and it sounds like he was on top for along time. It is when in his mind he thought he was loosing market share, he felt compelled to start fighting back. This strategy can backfire on the host I have seen it happen, you can tell when this is not working. The best thing to do is to be positive and let your crowd know where and when you will be playing next.