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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:26 pm 
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Kurt -

I know exactly who you are referring to when you say "The Cavs Unit Guy" interesting to note that at one time this person was a major contributing factor to the karaoke entertainment industry here in Portland for years. Now I believe that this person is inflicting damage to that very industry.

This type of marketing will eventually run its course and fail. These systems that are being sold are Super CDG units the song selection is broad but most of the manufacturers are of inferior quality. The bar owners are not going to keep the books up when they get wet or damaged, they will be reluctant to replace discs when they get scratched and wipe out 300 songs.

Plus what kind of show will  the KJ making $50 a night (probably less because the CAV's guy is getting his cut) produce? The way I figure is that reliablilty, work ethic, and customer skills of a person willing to work for this wage will eventually make the venue fail.

The more seasoned singers will gravitate to places where professsional KJ's are playing. The bar owners will tire of dealing with substandard KJ's and the high maintenance that comes along with it. Eventually the pendulum will swing back the other way.

If a quality KJ is replaced by one of these systems I would be suprised....but if they were, it would not take long for the owner of a bar to recognize that all of the KJ's following has gone with the KJ. Now he has to build karaoke clientel of his own. We all know how difficult this is to do...it takes years to build an excellent following and that is the part they don't understand, but they will get an excellent education on the subject once they choose the "do it yourself kit that the CAV's Guy" is offering.

As for the market demand for KJ's here in Portland....I have not had any difficulty in finding bar gigs here and getting the rates I need to remain profitable. Most have come from referrals from my base of satisfied customers and a few have come from local KJ referrals. I have been operating for 8 years on this premise and have not gone out and did any face to face marketing to get my gigs. Interesting to note that almost every one of my new gigs over the past 8 years have come from bars that have never tried karaoke before, and most of them have lasted for 2-3 years or more. It's a untapped market that most of the cut-throat KJ's would never think of approaching. I use to advertise in the local entertainment paper as it was a great way to bring in new customers to my venues. About 2 years ago I stopped my advertisiments beacause the customer draw diminished and the "Gig Stealers" began to appear and since stopping those ads they have gone away.

One of the Streets that I have a gig on here in Portland has 54 bars and restaurants in about 32 blocks. About 1/2 of them all have potential for karaoke or DJ services. You will never see a "Gig Stealer" hit those bars up for their services. It is much easier for them to go to the one gig that IS on that street and try to steal that one. Several have approached me about doing shows for them and I have referred them to other KJ's due to my schedule being full.

Portland is growing by leaps and bounds. There are 20% more bars than there were last year at this time. Ownership with the other established bars changes at about 10-15% per year. Mr Gig Stealer will never know about them because he or she is too lazy to go out and earn new business themselves.

There was an excellent comment made in this thread about the TV repair shops all banding together and by sharing information on what they were charging etc. The rates for their services stabilized and actually went up. Convention services businesses did this here in the city about 6 years ago and room rates, fees etc. shot through the roof a couple of years later.

I'm interested in starting up an Association of KJ's here in Portland that would do just that...share info and be a support base for ideas of how to generate more business, stabilize rates, Refer each other etc. This would be one good way to make it more difficult for "mr gig stealer" to operate in this town.  I know it has worked in other parts of the country for KJ's and DJ's why not here!

What do you think guys ....wanna give it a try? :dancin:

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:41 pm 
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Flipper what do you think would be a good first step and then a plan of action.to form an association? Most Kj's or singers are not on the interenet so it would have to be sort of a grass roots or word of mouth type process. It would have to be organized to help the kj, bar owner and even the singers to make them want to patronize the bars in the association...

Years ago here one summer flyers from a differnt venue was put under the wind shield wipers of all the cars at a karaoke bar...I never could get it through some bars heads if I go to another venue I'm gonna be bringing people back from that venue....

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PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:50 pm 
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the type of association I was referring to would be primarily for KJ's. I'm not sure that bar owners would have interest. Singers may be something to be considered once the association was formed and mission statement and bylaws established.

I was targeting Portland Oregon KJs with my post as many of them are posters on this forum but I'm sure they would work just about everywhere. Change comes slowly but it's worth it.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 7:29 pm 
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karyoker @ Wed Jan 04, 2006 8:41 pm wrote:
That doesnt look familiar at all maybe I was thinking of something else.. I dont remember now... But I'm going to join this one....


I wouldn't: http://www.timmyth.com/?postid=6

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:36 pm 
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AKA- Re-assessment!

It has been brought to my attention that the AKA may not be what it says it is...I have heard from some KJs and other association members, and former members that problems exist aplenty at the AKA!  

Unfortunately, while the spirit of the association is right on, the mechanics of it could be faulty.  As such, I now wish to rescind my hearty recommendations of them and suggest that all interested parties take a "wait and see" approach.


I suggest anyone concerned read the link posted above, and read also the forums at the AKA site, and proceed with caution.  

I can only wait and hope for the emergence of a truly valuable karaoke organization led by industry pros whose aim is to further the karaoke business and support all KJs in their work, irregardless of politics!

If anyone knows of such a thing,  please do tell...

...just my 2 cents...

Roxie

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 15, 2006 9:44 pm 
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If what your thinking of is like a musicians union--dont expect it to really solve an problems for you---musicians and bands get all the same backstabbing that goes on with karaoke. Dog-eat-dog, every man for themselves.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 5:58 am 
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Aaah the good old Music Union. NOT

I remember using the music union to threaten a guy who wouldn't pay us after a gig.
That's about all it was good for. He did finally pay us. I knew when I threatened him.
The music union wouldn't have done squat.

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PostPosted: Mon Jan 16, 2006 11:50 am 
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Not sure if your question regarding "union" was to me or someone else.

What I was referring to is a group of local KJ's that meet say once a month to see if we can figure out a way to bring the price for bar gigs back to where it should be here in our local area. Also be supportive of each others business vs the opposite.

I for one have at least one or two gigs a month that come my way that I simply can't handle due to full bookings. Why not refer those to someone in the group and keep the "Gig Stealers" out of those places.

I have a couple of KJ's that I currently network with here that are interested in this idea.

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