Karaoke Forums

I have been looking very closely at the new neodymium LM15 cabs from carvin. I would want to use them for our band as well as karaoke. The trouble i have had with peavey PR lites, and other brands, are a loss of bottom end. They seem to need more power to push the same amount of sound, anyone else use a neodymium speaker cab? i really like the fact that the carvin LM15 only weighs 31 pounds, sell for $239.99, and have a 3" voice coil along with 425 watts, so the specs are about the best for any neodymium cab....your thoughts?

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Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

With any speaker, you are going to want to push their program power rating.  Peavey are notoriously power hungry - even their lower models, but once you get that power correct, they sound great.
I personally don't really care for any molded box cabinet, they typically aren't going to yield the bottom end a good designed wood cabinet will offer (there are always exceptions to that rule), but they do have convenience factor - main one being weight.  The Carvin will require an amp that pushes about 500 watts per channel to sound their best.  Carvin makes great equipment for the price - especially their power amps.

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thanks for the reply, i have been using carvin products for over 40 years now for  guitar, pedal steel, and PA mains. I currently own a studio full. I have had plastic mack's that sounded just fantastic, they would give any wooden cab a run for their money. So yes, a plastic cab, can sound as good as a wood cab, Of course they were loasded with 15" cast frame transducers, flat wound VC's and were thermal efficent. Took very little power to run them. But these new neo's are a little different. For the same amount of power, it takes noticeably more power to push them. I think more work might be needed with them before i will feel confident with them. I was just wondering how everyone felt about them is all. I do use subs with karaoke, we have a lot of folks who like to dance. But i still miss the bottom on the mics. Just a bit thin. Thanks for your opinions. Here is a pic of my studio with just some of my carvin gear...

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Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

personally I like the new  Peavey  all I do is add a little more bass and they sound as good or better than the sp2's that I used to use  37 pounds vs. almost 100  no brainer in my book

I have and use on occasions a pair of the Peavey PR12"

They are GREAT for what they were intended to be - A pair of LIGHTWEIGHT 12" PA speakers. - For small to medium sized venues I find them a BLESSING - 30 lbs versus 50+ for the Yamaha 15's.   They DO NOT have the bass response of the wooden 15" and I don't expect them too.  I heard that the PR15's have a better BASS but still not up to par with the wooden heavier conterparts.  

SO if you looking for some dance kicking bass...Use the lightweights with a SUB

you're right the 15's don't have quite as much bass as a wooden cabinet but all I do is add a little bass with the eq and as long as you don't crank the volume WAY up they sound great

I always wondered how this works too.  Hartke for instance came out with their lighter weight transporter cabs, and awhile back a few companies ("Art" was one company years ago), and others also came out with plastic cabs vs wooden cabs for weight purposes, and now plastic cabs abound.  Heavy fiberglass was always being used for bass applications "Sunn" used this in their Coliseum 2X15 reflex cab however it weighed over 400 lbs loaded with EV SRO's.  It seems reasonable that cabinet design, cabinet density considering resonance factors, and tonal aspects of wood (even when considering musical instruments--IE...  Plastic body vs Wood body or Graphite body, or other composite materials) Most favor "wood".  While the bass I played in Jr High (in orchestra) was "fiberglass", and it was loud, the "wood" basses (especially at the more easily discernible higher notes) gave a warmer sound.   For other tonal aspects, given timbre wanted...Brass instruments sound great.  As to whether Wood cabs give off the best sound...  I honestly don't know.  I suppose this depends of frequency areas, but in terms of warmth,  I think density and material defineatly come into play.  How much of this is just psychological, and wouldn't be noticeable in a "blind" test..  I don't know. So many mock (and mocked) Kama Aerospace- Ovation for the plastic concept of the guitar, but quite honestly, I like the sound from their higher end guitars acoustically.  Graphite is now used for some very high end instruments,  (I have no firsthand experience hearing the timbre and resonant capabilities of graphite for body construction)

I have yet to hear a very small speaker that can give off phantom bass that even comes near the depth of 15's or 18's front loaded that are designed to handle bass frequency.  Some claim, that cabs such as the SWR Henry (bass cab)  I think 6 or 8 8 inch speakers in the cab DO in fact cover the tonal spectrum that an 18 or a few 15's would cover.

We are in a similar situation.  I too am no longer a spring chicken, and have equipment sitting around such as my Hammond B-3,  Ampeg SVT cabs,  Amps and amp heads that weigh more than most cabs today, Altec VOTT bins, etc.  Stuff I love, that I'll never be able to move, actually in most cases never could move alone.  LOL.

As weird or "off base" as this might sound,  I've always favored the sound of paper speakers over plastic speakers too.  I just don't feel plastic gives the same response. There are certain areas of newer technology that I just don't feel CAN match older technology in terms of quality of sound produced. In some cases there was in fact a reason for big and heavy,  question of course being HOW big and heavy is really necessary ?  (Despite how inconvenient lugging of OLDER may be, and may have been).  Yet I don't know.  It's often subjective, and one can only compare likes with likes..   Those of us that grew up with huge cabs, and heavy stuff realize that new technology has produced amazingly efficient cabs (such as 2X10's handling 400 watts) when compared in a head to head with certain older 15 folded horn or large reflex cabs.  I'm still trying to learn which areas have been improved upon, as opposed to which other areas are for purposes of compromising weight, yet also at the expense of some sound.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Steven, i like your way of thinking. But we use to drive cars that were several thousands of pounds heavier then they needed to be. But with the research in carbon composite materials and there are several, i think the new musical products can only be a plus for all of us. My good friend Maurice Andersen owns the MSA Steel Guitar Company in Dallas Texas. And he builds an all Carbon Composite pedal steel guitar. I have played one of reeces steels. Just a breath taking beautiful guitar, dead accurate, and it will sustain as long or longer then any wood built pedal steel on the planet. I also own an Ovation Tangent 6 string which is also made of carbon composite materials. Here is a link to this beautiful pedal steel guitar built by my friend Reece Andersen http://www.msapedalsteels.com/html/features.html
I am not a physics professor, and can't tell a person any formulas for the sound resonance of a wood cab, as opposed to a plastic cab. I would imagine by just being wood alone it would have more ring to it i suppose. But what if any purpose that would serve as far as over all sound i have not been shown really. I use to lug around a Fender Twin Reverb with 2 12" JBL's to every gig. But now i use a little Peavey Nashville 112, as do most of the steel guitar players in the world, and i can't see how i got along without my little peavey for so many years. We use the peavey PR Subs, we are currently using two of them. And they do the job for medium sized clubs. It's not all about weight. But when you add the weight to sound ratio, i think the plastic cabs will come out on top. JMHO

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Sweet Little Me In Karaokeland........

Isn't that particular model designed specifically for you steel players though ?  Not sure how it differs from the Peavey Classic series (which I ALSO love),  tube amps.. But not sure the Peavey Nashville is, I don't know much about it... I thought they had a 15 inch w BW and were higher wattage and larger..  Didn't know they still had the 1x12 in production.  Peavey makes GREAT stuff,  no question.  I guess things are more efficient today..  In the older days a 1x12 couldn't out perform a Twin.. Today things are different, speaker technology is more efficient.

Actually I'd be combing the guitar shops for
http://www.fender.com/support/manuals/p ... osonic.pdf

Or a quad reverb (twin head thru 4x12 combo config)...   The warmth of tube tone for Steel harmonics would be great IMHO  :worship:  



True,  but even they had advantages.. At least for a long time, the metal and quality of the frames were better than production cars that came shortly after their death, early 80's small cars rotted out quite quickly, today alloy technology has come a long way.
I had one of those clunkers up until about 4 years ago... A 70's Buick Le Sabre (as a second car,  My other car was a Mercedes ).  When was the last time you drove in an older car "several thousand lbs heavier than necessary though?" They really were a SMOOTH ride !   Could hardly feel those boats moving.  Good quality cars !   They lasted and lasted especially when garaged.  The car I have now is a fancy Dodge Concorde, and although it's a nicer looking car, given comfort of ride, those OLD cars (when maintained) really were an amazing car to drive in terms of size and comfort...   As were many of the old clunker cabs and amps to hear...  Well not to transport  LOL .    Funny thing too, the days of those large heavy cars were about the only times I never got carsick as a passenger.  I recall the 60's VW bugs, and the small cars ,  dang,  small even today just gets me nauseated as a passenger,  those large boats never did !   Sorry, got off-topic. But same can be said for solid state vs tube amp technology, granted,  weight is lighter, but I have yet to hear the warmth I hear in a head-to-head with a tube amp... Given a Fender Super Reverb vs todays solid state amps,  I'd really like to hear a head to head and see if the warmth is still their (at least as I perceive the sound).   JMO
True,  there's a trade off.   weight was heavy,  size was BIG....BUT,  it sounded good.  Cars were heavy,  but heavy and large had quite a few advantages too IMHO..   It's all as you've stated trade-off, and individual preference however in terms of practicality, today few have choices....


Don't get me going on old technology  LOL .  Not that it's a strong area for me in terms of tech knowledge.   I'm at a loss for that across the board,  I just remember the qualitative aspects...  Nothing under the hood[/quote]

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Is MSA Sho-bud ?   The neck chess pieces are reminiscent of the older sho-bud models ?  Or did the patent go after Gretsch---> Baldwin---->Fender--->Fair game for grabs ????



Yep,  I periodically check out Pedal Steel Guitar used markets because I'm looking for a decent one at a LOW price.   I'm a multiinstrumentalist, have lap-steel, and although I don't have anymore room I'D love to learn Pedal-steel,  I just love the sound (I love country rock).  Really a gorgeous instrument, and a TOUGH instrument to play well, but dang, there's no prettier an instrument in my opinion when the pedal steel player tastefully fills in.  

Problem is, this is a pretty intricate area I know nothing about.  I've not tried one in years.  Ideally if I could find a nice used Sho-bud (barring the Maverick model), Emmons, or Carter for under 1K that's a single 10 string with three knee and three floor, I'd give it serious thought, but the market for a decent pedal steel has ALWAYS been pretty high,  they are nice instruments.. and I can't have junk.  They aren't cheap.

If you have any info for me on how to purchase an affordable instrument  please let me know in my Music and Musician thread in the main discussion forum.

                                                                                                Thanks

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".